Super Mario Bros. Forum  /  Which hard trick should I learn first
(edited: )

So I just got my first sub 5 yesterday, it's still awaiting verification though. But I was wondering which hard trick should I learn first, BBG or FPG? Which one is easier?


Don't even bother with any of them before you go for a 4:57, after that most people learn bbg as it's easier and saves more time over fpg.

RedHopeRedHope likes this. 

GG's on the sub 5!
Pexxio is quite right, but in any case, definitely BBG: by diference the easiest of the "hard tricks" group you could name in this game (others like fpg, blazit...), and saves 2 framerules (almost any other thing save 1)
then you also have for example blazit or 1-2 pipe clip, that kinda depends of the person

RedHopeRedHope likes this. 
(edited: )

@PexxioPexxio isnt bbg required to get 4:57?

without fpg strats ofc


@SavirTheSpeedrunnerSavirTheSpeedrunner Basically, after runners get Mid/Low 4:58 (By normal Framerules + 1-Frame Walljump), they add in BBG to save 2 Framerules, and thus get something like 4:57.6xx.


I'd say don't mess with the flagpole glitch until you get more like a 4:57 ish, but that's just me. bullet bill clip is a lot easier, so that's def worth learning before flagpole glitch. but honestly, movement is so much more important anyway, and without the fpg or the bbg, you can easily get 4:56 or lower. perfect your movement, then learn bbg first.

RedHopeRedHope likes this. 

Thanks for all the feedback guys. Much appreciated


I would say the progression should be Sub 5 (gg btw) > 4:58.3xx (1f 8-4) > 4:57.6xx (BBG). That’s the route I’m taking anyways…as far as after that goes, I would probably start with Blazit, I find it easier than FPG once you start to get consistent inputs. Also @ApianbelleApianbelle you definitely cannot get with no FPG or BBG…even with Lightning 4-2 and TAS 8-4 you are looking at 4:57.2xx or something


@Binsky48 I personally am a micro-PBer and i want to have a progression, so I'd go Sub 5 > Mid/High 4:58 (2f wj) > Low/Mid 4:58 (1f wj) > 4:57.9xx (BBG + 2f) > 4:57.6xx (BBG + 1f).
I might directly jump from Low/Mid 4:58 to 4:57.6xx, not sure, but im definitely doing the route before that.


@Binski48Binski48 GGs on sub 5! Clean up your 4:59 to get 4:58 then do BBG for 4:57.


Ok unpopular opinion here: you should learn FPG. Not to implement in runs since you can get a low 4:58 without any hard tricks, but more to save runs that have a bad 1-1 underground or even get 4-1 FPG if you slowed down too much in 1-2


8-3 fpg Kappa

SpeedInSpeedIn likes this. 

You should learn both. BBG you could probably get in about a minute by just jumping at the bullet until it works, while FPG requires more finesse. Don't worry at all about adding them into runs until you have at least a mid 458 however, and ideally you should get ~4:58.3 with one frame wj before adding any hard tricks

RipJaws768RipJaws768, adriKKadriKK and SavirTheSpeedrunnerSavirTheSpeedrunner like this. 

You can learn hard tricks withiut actually do then in a speedrun. I know how to do blazit clip and fpg, but my best speedrun is 6:30. So learn tgen, but you don't have to use them.