Interest in a "No-Intro" category?
2 years ago
United States

If it could be proven that the intro section is consistently the same for everyone, and that it truly has no bearing on the run or no optimizations to be had, I would agree that there should be some consideration in it being cut.

As it stands though, it IS an optimize-able section. You CAN take better/worse lines and save/lose time in the section. It's not "on rails" by any means. It's not even like there's some large RNG section that we have to worry about at the end which determines if we have to reset.

Without even getting into the issues of console accessibility, how saves will be either created or shared, legitimacy of saves for the setup (manipulating DA before the save is made, figuring out setups to guarantee pickups later, or creating advantages we don't even know about given the freshness of the game), how many people are actually interested in a no-intro category, etc., I just can't see an argument for a no-intro category as it stands.

The boards aren't even up yet, so we can't compare, but I guarantee there will be disparity in the intro section in the first batch of runs submitted, and for that reason alone it IS a part of the speedrun as it's a part you have to learn and optimize. It's nearly 2 hours RTA, and there will be plenty of runs that get an hour or more in and need to be reset. You'll have to play through the first hour of the game again, and again, and again... That's just the nature of speedrunning.

TrichaelMan, Mudkicker and 5 others like this
Phoenix, AZ, USA

yea definetely thats why i didnt start the thread i wanted to get some things in motion before bringing the idea to the public because it would need to have all those factors considered before the idea should be presented tbh. i tried some processes of making it but all have failed so i am asking people with knowledge of cheat engine for help

Alsace, France

I really don't get the point. At the end of the day it is gameplay, yeah you're not interacting with things, you're on a rail, but it's still movement optimization. I don't really care much if it happens though. If anything, I'll say that we're 1 week into the game (even less) and talking about dividing runners already with a meme category seems weird to me. Totally deserves more time, thinking and knowledge of the run before jumping on that ship imo. + I don't think cutting 6mn of """cutscene"""/gameplay would make the people stick to the run. RE7 was successful here on SRC even with literally unskippable cutscenes, it even opened a door to speedrunning for many people. So yeah I kinda back Zgl on that point; people say they want no-intro but watch the board be like 10 people running it, at least that's what happened when you look at RE7 or RE3R

TrichaelMan, Mudkicker and 2 others like this
Canada

Idk, as a new speedrunner who will be doing this most likely as their first game I don't see much of an issue.

Secondly, from what I'm seeing on this entire thread it's just you (Waifu) who's really advocating against the intro part of the game. Is it kind of redundant to do the intro over and over again? Sure. However, the run itself is already coming down to under 2 hours and it hasn't even been closed to optimized yet. If you're used to speedrunning spammy APM heavy games then yeah this might not be the game for you to run, but as someone who's watched -alot- of RE7 speedruns the flow of RE8 speedruns seems pretty similar to its previous title).

So if doing a 5minute intro is a deal breaker for a run that actually looks really fun to do then I'm not really sure what to tell you.

Edited by the author 2 years ago
TrichaelMan, AdrianMamba and 6 others like this
Florida, USA

Best case scenario make it category extension. If you want to practice the "actual gameplay" then practice the actual gameplay.

You should be practicing specific sections you lose time at anyway, nothing stopping you from doing that on your own time if you've really optimized the intro on your own.

If enough people submit to the extension board then maybe it's worth a table talk discussion on migrating it to the main boards.

As it sits, there's plenty to mess up in that intro. I really don't want to hear about people being sick of putting Rose to bed when I've done it 300+ times finding flags for the load remover tbqh.

TrichaelMan, KittensXO and 8 others like this
Phoenix, AZ, USA

there are several people who do want a no intro category, but it is much to early to discuss it, with no actual way of doing it at the moment the logistics not being there. There isnt much that can even be argued either way. hense why i didnt make the thread

Canada

You may have not made the thread Waifu but you're still advocating pretty hard for it. Doesn't take a genius to click on your profile or do some research on who you are to be able to realize you speedrun a lot of games so a newbie like myself might come into a thread and be like "Oh he's a pretty active speedrunner maybe he's right"

But luckily for me I'm super critical about everything and everyone so I didn't really take your points at face value and I dug into them a bit more. You yourself just said the game is so new so why advocate for something like this on your socials and now here when it could be such a non issue.

Just feels like you're playing 2 sides of a coin where on one side you are super against the intro but when you get challenged on it you back up and say "Wait and see guys it's too early to tell"

Nothing wrong with having an opinion but the flip flopping is just odd to me.

I'm excited to run RE8 as my first ever speedrun game, my only experience "speedrunning" is in classic WoW and Mythic + in retail.

Game looks sick, story looks sick, replayability looks sick. So a 5 minute intro is an easy pill to swallow.

TrichaelMan, Mudkicker and 2 others like this
Phoenix, AZ, USA

im not flipping the coin i just dont think i can properly defend the position without having the logistics figured out because people do get hung up on said logistics, if someone wants to play the intro its not like im gonna change their mind, but if i have everything set on a platter and provide a valid option that requires no leaps of faith people are way more likely to compromise. thats exactly what mike did with 3make and it worked, now most of the high level runners run pretty much exclusively no intro.

so thats all really i just dont think its worth talking about until its even proven possible.

but yea that game is sick and either way i will have a lot of fun with it for a while, just longer without the intro ;)

CursedToast likes this
Canada

If you can't properly defend an opinion cause there isn't enough data out there to back it up then why even bring it up until there is? There shouldn't really be a need to compromise in general either in my opinion.

Trust me as a avid WoW player if one fan base knows how to complain it's us, I just don't see any merit to your stance at all yet.

The game is new, the mods are new, and personally I hope the mods here are a little more "strict" than other boards that I've seen that have a million and 1 categories and when I'm trying to see if I want to get into a game I have to go through all of them to see the one that has more than 5 people running it.

Less is more and once again I'm kind of a nobody but I waited until RE8 to see if I wanted to get into it and I do, but adding a bunch of categories that will be popular for like a month then die is a good way to just have a bunch of dead weight on the board instead of having a couple really popular categories.

Edited by the author 2 years ago
Phoenix, AZ, USA

well again, i didnt bring it up

Canada

But you have brought it up on your socials hence why the OP referenced you in this thread. You also chimed back in here to defend the stance.

Edited by the author 2 years ago
CannibalCanyon likes this
Canada

That's what I was referring to, yes. It popped up on my feed

Greater Manchester, England

This always gets suggested for resident evil games for some reason but never happens on the grounds that theres time saves and movement optimisations in the intro of the game.

Phoenix, AZ, USA

yea i brought it up to someone who has more knowledge than me in cheat engine? i did it publically in that thread because i assumed that there would potentially be people visiting that thread specifically with that kind of knowledge, that seems obvious, and the tweet was to gauge intrest in the idea from speedrun twitter, also hoping to reach out to people who may know how. i learned a lot from reaching out. idk why yall are being so confrontational

its only a sugguestion for a potential option

Edited by the author 2 years ago
United States

"idk why yall are being so confrontational"

just from the twitter thread alone, some of us saw that and were civil with you, then you proceeded to insult an entire speedrun community by calling their speedgame "terrible". you can't be confrontational yourself, then get confused why some members are being a little critical. the conversation here isn't even confrontational. we are just affirming that we don't think this is a good suggestion.

TrichaelMan, Mudkicker and 5 others like this
United States

you also called ZGL and I opinions invalid because we run on "console"...when in fact we have the game on both PC and console....

TrichaelMan, AdrianMamba and 3 others like this
England

No intro would be amazing. I believe the timer should start as Ethan drops down the hill and can finally equip weapons in NG+. The timer should however in this case begin once the player (you or I) begins the first input after the hill fall. This gives the player, if they are using a manual timer and not an offset timer, the chance to start time and move. That could easily be combined with the runner calculating the time it takes them to get into first point of movement after the hill drop, therefore making all runs fair and equal. However as there is no direct save point, many people would still be discouraged due to having to run that autoscroller everytime, more so on console NOT PC where you can easily copy an autosave state for future use, My proposal is definitely going to be different rulesets for PC and console because, as just mentioned, console, unless modded - therefore instantly invalidating a run - , cannot control autosave states.

Also to add to it, if this RE8 community is going to be as toxic as it already sounds, no-one, not even the Karens, are going to want to be part of it

Edited by the author 2 years ago
Phoenix, AZ, USA

i said console only runners should not vote on pc exclusive rulings, thats not a contraverscial opinion the people i was refereing to only had console runs on theier src page obviously if they run this game on pc their opinion matters in pc rulings.

re7 is a shit run and ill take that to my grave, but thats just my opinion yo, dont like it then dont listen to it.

either way im done talking about it, ill come back when i actually figure something out if i ever do