I am trying to do a 100% run. First time playing since 1999, and apparently I was able to do it in 2 hrs, 20 minutes at the last save point then.

I had to delete that file.

(I don't want to delete the other 2 save slots).

Started a new game a few days ago.

I'm at 1 hour, 29 minutes, with 115 missiles, 30 power bombs, 15 super missiles, most beams, 7 energy tanks, 2 reserve tanks.

I'm about to do the Wrecked Ship.

Can I finish the Wrecked Ship; Maridia; finishing off everything else in Norfair; and go to the final save point in Tourian, by about 2 hours, 45 minutes or so? (I'm allotting 15 minutes for Tourian).

It still feels like there's a lot to explore in Norfair, especially Ridley's lair.

I'm just trying to get to the best ending, no specific time requirements other than that.

It's hard to say. You've already used up half your time (you have to be under 3 hours) getting to Wrecked Ship. On the other hand, the internal clock stops at a lot of events (door transitions, item pickups, etc.). Is the time what's listed on the save screen or is it your own personal timer?

My personal advice would be to play the game through regardless to get the feel for where stuff is and how to do things. If you don't get the ending you want, play again using the knowledge of item locations. Maybe look up some speedrunning guides for quicker routes.

Thanks for the quick response.

This is the time on the save screen.

I've been following a guide to help me get the most items without backtracking. It wasn't designed with speed running in mind, but it mentions how to get items in the same area, or "early" ways to get some items. So to me, it seems pretty good, and an improvement over my own method back in 1999.

When I played the game in 1999, I felt I wasn't taking the best routes, and I felt I was always low on energy tanks when facing the boss in the Wrecked Ship. I believe I'd only have 4 or 5 at that time.

This time, in 2020, I have 7 plus 2 reserves, so I feel better.

My main reason for playing the game again is to avoid using the electrocute trick on Draygon. It felt too cheap, and I wish I had done it a more fair way back then.

However, I still want to get the best ending.

In general, I don't mind starting games over. However, during this run, I had read about the mockball trick, so I wanted to do it. I spent hours of real time (~ 5 minutes of game time, which includes the item pickups) before finally being able to execute it.

I know it's not necessary, but if I start over, I want to do it again, but am dreading re-doing it because it's hard.

I thought I was doing ok, @ 51 minutes which included an initial run through Norfair; beating Crocomire; and some item pickups.

I didn't think I'd be spending 38 minutes heading to the Wrecked Ship and getting the x-ray scope; 4x power bombs; 3 energy tanks, a reserve tank, and other items. But that's now I ended up at 1:29 from 51 minutes.

So I ended up at 3:30 entering the first save point of Tourian.

I did lose 6 - 7 minutes because I got stuck in the energy tank room in Ridley's hideout, and I had accidentally destroyed all of the firefleas, so it was hard to make my way back out of the room in the dark, especially with spikes below me.

Then it took another 5-7 minutes to re-fill on energy right before Ridley's door. Most of that energy had been lost in that spike room with the energy tank.

I didn't want to reset because I had already collected 3 powerups since my last save, and I already knew at this point I was going to break 3 hours, so it wouldn't make that much of a difference.

Plus, one of the missile powerups was annoying, because if I mess up, I fall through pit blocks and I have to loop back. It took me a few resets on that one to get it on the first try, AND make my way back out of the room without falling through the pit blocks too.

I finished the game @ 3:41.

I would have needed to improve by 45 minutes, don't think I could have done that in this run. I didn't see that much room for improvement, other than the 2 times I described.

I accomplished my main goals, which was beating Draygon without the cheap trick, and getting 100%.

Apparently I never got 100% before.

In my first file from 1999, the 14 hour one, I only had 190/230 missiles, 40/50 super missiles, and 45/50 power bombs.

In my 2nd file from 1999, the 3:40 entering Tourian one, I had 215/230 missiles. That must have been annoying to see 97%.

I'm also thinking that that 2:20 file that I deleted wasn't me. It could have been someone else, and I didn't check to see if that 100% of items either. I also don't think I could have gotten 2:20 back in 1999, when my 2nd file was 3:40 entering Tourian, and my file this time was 3:30 entering Tourian. Given that these other two are similar, I don't think I could have been that much better for the 2:20 time, and had that file at 100%, so it might have been someone else's non-100% file.

Question: Is it possible to beat Draygon at the beginning of Maridia? It would make some of the jumps much easier in that level, if I already had the space jump.

Also, can I enter Maridia from Crateria, then go straight to Draygon? I am worried this metal door may keep me out, until I beat the mini boss (and if that's the case, then I'd rather enter Maridia through Brinstar, as I normally do).

From my knowledge, if you are playing the game MORE for Fun and LESS for speed (more casual / fast-run rather than a speed run), it's pretty beneficial to go straight to Draygon and skip everything because space jump is such an amazing movement upgrade for speed and fun at any skill level.

That metal door unlocks after Draygon along with the plasma door, so you cannot go through that way to get to Draygon.

Let me know if I missed anything, but Super Metroid is an active community so I'm sure someone will answer any questions you have :)

Thanks. I think the next time I play, I want to try and get the best ending. I don't need to get an all-time record, just something that's good enough to be at 2:45 at the start of Turian.

I also do want to get 100% again, though.

I think I will try to go to Draygon first, both because I want to get space jump earlier. And because I feel it comes a little late in the game. And because it will make some of those jumps in Meridia easier. There's a few places where I didn't make the jump on the first or second try, and it sets me back in the bottom of the room.

For example, the room with the energy tank with Tatori, I miss on my grapple attempt a few times.

A question about the story. Why does the giant Metroid help Samus, during the Mother Brain fight? I never understood that part. Especially since it drained Samus health just a few minutes before that.

Whose side, if either side, are the Metroids on, in this game? Are they neither on Samus side, nor Mother Brain's side?

the baby metroid is the metroid samus didn't kill at the end of metroid II, she was about to destroy the egg when it hatched and the metroid when seeing samus took it for its mother, so she take it to ceres station and when it drain samus for dramatic reason it only recognize samus at the last moment, and help her agains mother brain as it want to save its mom

also you may want to do kraid, phantoon, draygon then ridley in this order in term of boss, as you need some item in some place before being able to get the other, speedbooster for wrecked ship reserve, and space jump for golden torizo missiles, and that place which has crumble block to help you get it, morph and hold jump, with springball it will auto jump on crumble block making it very easy to cross it, also with plasma GT and ridley are more easy to beat, GT also has a cheese spot to kill him quickly and without trouble, you might want to see a speedrun for that making it a ton easier to kill him

From Metroid 1, the space hunters both want to capture the Metroids so they don't multiply excessively, and they want to stop the space pirates on Zebes.

In this game, I guess the mission is the rescue the Metroid larva from Ridley. But then I don't know where the giant Metroid fits in.

The instruction book also says that the Science Academy wants to use the Metroids for beneficial purposes.

So do the Metroids know that the Galactic Federation no longer wants to eliminate them? And they want to preserve them, and use them for beneficial purposes? If the Metroids know that, whey do they still attack Samus?

Or, is it hard to know what the Metroids are thinking, because they're still a life force not completely understood?

So is that why the giant Metroid's behavior is so unpredictable? I mean, was there a reason why it gave Samus the Hyper Beam instead of giving it to Mother Brain?

@FrenchLightningJohn

Thanks, I forgot it recognized Samus as the mom, in the beginning video.

Yeah, that's the order I did the bosses.

I did not know the springball autojumps on the crumble block. I will try that out (so I know to do that for next time).

I'll look at the video for Golden Torizo.

I like the special power bomb attack when a beam + charge beam is used.

For example, ice beam + charge beam + selecting power bomb results in a special attack.

Is there a good room to use these, though? Like when there's enemies right above or below?

I like how they added these power bomb attacks, as each beam results in a different special attack.

But I want to find a good place to use them, and not just use them for the same of using them. I want to use them somewhere where those attacks will likely hit targets and inflict damage.

Sort of like how there's some places where using the spring ball, or x-ray, or grappling beam, or space jump make the game easier, or are almost required, I want to find a good place for these power bomb beam attacks.

It should probably be somewhere where it is either more advantageous, or at about the same level of advantage, to use these, versus using a regular beam attack.

The ice one almost seems the best, since it doesn't disappear right away.

spazer SBA is only usefull as a safety for phantoon for GT max%, plasma SBA as no use, ice SBA is only usefull in a 14% category that use ice beam, the most useful one is wave SBA where it is use on 3 boss and depending of the route and category, old route aka KPDR use it for phantoon, botwoon and draygon, while new route aka PRKD use it for ridley, botwoon and draygon

also all SBA except ice one deal 300 DMG per particle, while ice one deal 90 per particle (the DMG of a ice charge shot) if you want to know more about all of those the SM discord can be an easier place to ask question and the wiki as plenty of info for that, also watching speedrun might help you know where they are the most optimal to use

There are a few places where it can be "advantageous" to use special beam attacks but for the most part, it's never worth it. in a casual sense. Examples of where people DO use it are almost exclusively in boss fights, and it is hard to do.

For example, the x-factor (Wave + charge) is used in the phantoon fight to deal a lot of damage to the boss fast, but to do it you need to be VERY well versed in the fight.

The X-Factor is also used in the Draygon fight along with short charging and a shine spark through Draygon to kill Draygon in 2 swoops.

The Ice Shield (Ice + Charge) is only used effectively in 2 places, the Ridley fight, and Mother Brain 2 fight. Even then, it is only used in the Low% Ice beam category of speedrunning to speed up those VERY difficult fights, so it is not even worth doing in a playthrough where you have an abundance of super missiles and Ice + Wave + Plasma + charge. (I assume you will have all the beams and almost every upgrade by the time you fight Ridley as you are going for 100% which makes the beam combo methods on Mother brain and Ridley SIGNIFICANTLY harder and less worth it)

In short, the game never has a spot where one of those abilities is specifically intended for progression or that makes the beam combo satisfying to use. I don't believe any room is really designed with these special beam attacks in mind.

If you really are looking for places to use it, you probably want to use it earlier in the game, as the later you go into the game the less effective they are and the better it is just to shoot enemies. BUT just for the fun-factor I would recommend (AKA personal opinion on which combos I think are the most fun) playing with the plasma + charge combo in places with a lot of enemies or using spazer + charge in bubble mountain (the big room in Norfair with all the bubbles) to kill the annoying flying guys (waivers)

Other than that just look at what each one does and think of ways it would help i guess, I have never really messed with them too much so I bet there are a lot of cool things you can do with them just to have fun in the game! If you think of any cool one's I would love to hear them tho!

MAYBE (I have not tested it, so who knows) the Spaser + charge combo hits enemies through the floor I THINK, so you might be able to use it on your way to get wave beam and speed booster where all those sea-horse looking monsters jump out of the floor and kill them before they even have a chance to jump up? I think that would be cool!

(This is the room I am talking about for the killing the seahorses on the way to wave beam)

@FrenchLightningJohn:

Thanks for the post. I hadn't know about the new route until you mentioned it. I just read about it.

I don't think I want to do Phantoon early. When I initially played the game a few times in 1999, I always had problems with Phantoon, as I seemed to face him with only 4 or 5 energy tanks, and it would take me several tries to beat him.

This time, during a run that I actually found 100% of items, I had 7 energy tanks and 2 reserves. I think it only took me 2 tries, so I'm glad being better prepared for him made it easier this time.

It seems like a good thing try the SBAs against Phantoon and Botwoon, so I will probably do that.

@Desmous:

I didn't like grappling and electrocuting to beat Draygon in the past. It didn't feel as satisfying and felt cheap.

I was glad to finally beat him this time without any tricks. I learned how to use power bombs to avoid his glue attack, something I didn't know about before in 1999.

Those are good ideas on rooms to use them (bubble mountain; the sea-horse room). I will try them out sometime.

Right now, since I just finished the game again, I'm just going around various rooms and practicing or messing around, to see if I can find some different things to try. This is a good time to try things. So that when I play for real on a new game, and try to get a better 100% time, I'll have a better idea of some other things that might work.

I initially liked the spazer SBA combo because yes, I think it does go through the floor, so it seems like it might be fun on the seahorses.

Just mentioning a few things I learned.

From 35:15 - 35:25, this guy mentions that a plasma SBA is the equivalent to 4 charged shots, so it does 1200 damage.

Re-reading @FrenchLightningJohn's post above, he was saying the same thing. Seeing someone actually use it in a boss fight, helped me understand it better.

I don't know if I personally would be able to aim the shots as well as the people in these videos do. I have a feeling some of my particles will miss. But it at least gives me another reason to try using them, to get a feel for how effective I can use them in boss fights.

This video also helped me see how to use spinesharking in a few of the rooms of Maridia. So I will try them too, to see if I can do them.

I don't want to change everything about the way I played. But finding a few things to shave a few minutes here and there, is what will help me get under 3 hours.

I don't want every boss fight to be 30 seconds, the way some people do them.

he didn't say plasma SBA but x-factor which is wave SBA, and also he made a mistake by saying its the equivalent of 4 charge shot (everybody make mistake it happens) x-factor particle deal 300 DMG per particle so yes 1200, but wave charge shot is 150 DMG, maybe he was talking the equivalent of ice/wave/spazer charge shot which is 300 DMG also a posibility, just to say plasma deal 150 alone, a charge shot is 450 so not really useful since when you have plasma you have ice and wave normally with it, togheter with plasma it deal 300 DMG, 900 charge

Good catch.

I'm now realizing that once I have the plasma, a charged shot with that plus the other beams is better than a super missile. And it has less of a chance of missing, then a super missile would, or a wave SBA.

How did people figure out how many hitpoints each enemy in the game was, and how much damage each beam or attack did?

I don't think these things were in the instruction manual. So was it in Nintendo Power, or something? That seems like it would be a lot of pages of info in a magazine. Then again, I remember seeing every variation of Street Fighter 2 moves, with frame by frame pictures, in those magazine issues.

There was enemy health info in the Player's Guide at least, maybe in Nintendo Power too. But in the modern era a bunch of info like that has been found by reverse engineering the game. Pages people have compiled together like this one tell us where to find the enemy HP, then we can figure out the damage of each attack from there: http://patrickjohnston.org/ASM/ROM%20data/Super%20Metroid/RAM%20map.asm

Thanks. Either I never knew about the existence of Player's Guides, or I had forgotten about them.

I see they were made for these games:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_Player%27s_Guide

I can say that I never owned a single one, probably because I wasn't a subscriber of Nintendo Power.

There were always a few secret in games, that I wondered how people ever figured out. But they seemed like common knowledge. I always wondered how it seemed like everyone knew these things, because it didn't seem obvious to me.

One example was the first warp whistle in Super Mario Brothers 3. I wondered how it seemed like everyone knew to not only go on top of the dungeon wall, but then also press UP. Why would someone think there was a door there? If people had been used to Super Mario Brothers 1, I can see how they would want to go on top of the dungeon wall. But in Super Mario Brothers 1, there were always warp pipes in plain view after going over the wall.

So if someone was expecting similar behavior in Super Mario Brothers 3, they would have encountered a point at which the screen stopped moving. So then why would someone think there's a door, and that they had to press UP?

This was probably revealed in the aforementioned Player's Guide. It was also shown in the movie "The Wizard".

The other secret was the Top Secret area in Super Mario World. Again, it seemed like everyone knew it, but there were no hints that would have lead one there. For example, usually there's a single coin, or some sort of indicator, that one might want to explore an area, or fly there.

This was probably also revealed in the Player's Guide, which is why it seemed like everyone knew it.

I always asked people, did you find these on your own, or did someone tell you? The answer always seemed to be that someone told someone or showed someone.

I assume the maps for Super Metroid probably came from those Player's Guide too.

For Mario 3, I saw The Wizard, so I think I learned about it from that.

I never had a Nintendo Power subscription, but my town library did, so I would often borrow issues from them and read them. I think they may have had some of the Player's Guides, but I can't remember if I ever saw the SM one.

For some games I also remember writing a few letters to Nintendo's "game counselors" for help with some games; the two I remember asking for help with are Zelda 2 and Crystalis.

When it comes to SM I'm not sure I had any outside resources -- I know I got 100% (still have the savefile on my childhood cart!), but I didn't know about Crystal Flash or the SBAs until a couple decades later.