I dont think R¤ intended for people to play through their game as fast as possible. They wanted to give players a unique experience, wanted them to explore the map and have cool 6 star rampages lasting for two hours, and here we are skipping the story, not dicking around and not enjoying the missions.

We should ban speedrunning.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cheat

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/cheat

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cheat

here is a link to part of GTASA's rulebook. Read it thoroughly, and you will learn glitches aren't cheats.

I think its a GFWL thing, which can be avoided by just using a guest account

B ) Compromises need to be made. External tools to work around it is silly.

If a skip X is found, then naturally you should do it. However if the skip means you cant do skip Y anymore, then that's a compromise you have to make. If you want to do skip Y, then you can, but at the cost of skip X.

If there was some external software that would let you do skip X without getting locked out of skip Y, would that be allowed?

In this case, skip X is less waiting for the clock and skip Y is waiting for loadings.

A ) Kyle makes good points in that there's probably some GPU out there that lets you toggle it to be shit temporarily. However, there's also mice and keyboard out there of which the software lets you assign a combination of keystrokes (scripts) to the extra buttons on the side of it. Scripts are banned in many games, whether done third party like Autohotkey, second party like Logitech Gaming Mouse, or first party, like the game's .cfg files. This includes the official mouse capabilities.

Doesn't take away the fact that side applications like downloads/windows update/PB videos/recording software/virus scanners/video calls/ethan's map tool/malware/etc do the same thing as a frame limiters.

The only real way to provide an even playing field is to have vsync on at all times, like the 3d gta frame limiter. Loadings shouldnt be timed anyways.

Therefore I would vote B, but I choose to abstain from voting instead.

@Odyssic: half-life's ingame FPS changing ability is just as sketchy as using external software, but (gold)source runners are notorious for allowing cheats/console commands during runs, so yeah.

Edit: According to Jolzi the long loadings BS is a vsync only issue, if this is true, then I vote C) Allow external limiters, but no toggling on/off mid run, since it achieves all the good stuff without the bad stuff. Not toggling it on/off means you're not really 'using' the tool.

Will limiting the FPS to 60 by external frame limiter also make loading times really long, or is that a vsync only issue?

I would like to stress that you should practice LV, and even SF, Desert and RTLS, more than LS and Badlands. These cities/missions are much harder and you're more likely to fuck them up in runs. They're also a lot more fun.

In any case I vote E) Allow an external frame limiter, but have it either on or off during the entirety of the run, no toggling and switching mid-run, or use the ingame option.

Kyle makes a good point that booting GTA5 in the background is likely to limit the framerate too. The definition of 'frame limiter' is weird to me.

So enable Vsync for the helicopter part but not for the loading screens?

So getting up is easy on 80 FPS and Vsync limits your game to 60 or even less than that? Somebody explain to me why just using Vsync isn't an option then? I haven't seen an answer to that in this thread.

Try the resources section, I saw some saves there but IDK which version/category etc.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cheat

Ctrl + Shift isn't a rare keycombination for some gamers though. (Crouch + Sprint, Sneak + Jump, whatever). Be wary of accidentally changing your keyboard layout back, it has a bigger chance of killing your run than activating a WASD cheat in the first place.

Gael's tool is official by microsoft, I see 0 reason to disallow it and I've been pondering about it for a while, as long as it's not automated processes done by a single button press (scripting)

Alternatively, you could enable steer with mouse and avoid having to press buttons altogether.

Many different combinations of WASD cheats means you're only more likely to choke and press the wrong combination. Not getting accidental cheats is something an SA runner needs to deal with. If they can't, then they should probably find a different game.

"if you're gonna focus on not trying to enter a accidental cheat, you will just end up making tons of mistakes." Then you're a shit runner. A good runner can focus on both.

Runs with WASD cheats had been accepted as a "we don't care about your non-WR run having these kind of cheats". HAWORTH's run is one of these, that I would personally not verify, and was also submitted before any real discussion was had on the topic, so it's grandfathered in.

Fact is, a cheat is a cheat, and cheats are not allowed. Even the tiniest things such as spawning a Quad can affect your run, as it can have an effect on the cars in memory, determining traffic spawns. Weather also has an impact, ie visibility of the road, rain physics, car spawns maybe?

The cheat may be accidental, but entering the wrong combination of WASD by accident is a choke just like pressing the wrong buttons on Vertical Bird can send your plane into the water/rocks. It just with a bit more dire consequences.

I like the use of the word walls. There are a lot of steps that one must overcome in speedrunning.

1. Finishing a category casually. Knowing what the game is is the first step in learning. Speedruns that haven't done this step are blind runs. Joshimuz shows that you don't get a very good time when you do runs without learning this step.
2. Learn a route. Routeless runs are fun, I personally did a lot of them (including GTA 100% runs), but in order to get better times, one must figure out a route. You can look up a route from others, or make one yourself. If you don't have a route, your run probably won't be any better than Aces_High's 100% run. He shows though that great knowledge of the game goes a long way in getting you close to a decent time, but to get better times, a more thought out route is required.
3. Learn not to fail. Having a route is nice, but if you fuck up every trick in the run you're not going anywhere. S. demonstrates that with minimal failure, a very low time is possible already. But there is a limit.
4. Become fast. To become even faster, one must start grinding. This is also partially a routing step: Is going to left of the pole faster than going to the left of it? Which turns do I use the handbrake in and which ones do I not? Which trees/walls/poles can be used as a reference point for slight bends in the road, making look-behind-strats possible? Nobody has ever applied this step to 100% Vice City, but it is a step already done a lot by quite a few any% runners.
5. Grind for that RNG and get the good times. Also never done in 100%, but the any% WR is a good example of this.
6. Get the god run. Very few games get the honor of having runs like this. Super Mario Bros maybe?

Personally, I usually lose interest in my speedruns after (nearly) completing step 3.

It is important to know what your next step in becoming a good speedgamer is. There's no point in grinding runs if you don't have a route. Of course you need to maintain it all too; routes constantly update, so that driving route you practised really hard may become useless soon. You will also forget how to do things, commonly referred to as rust. As an example: I have plotted most of my games on a chart, allowing myself to see what work needs to be done first on all my speedgames in the event I were to pick them back up. Most of the dxhr/hl2/portal route has changed since I last ran it, but I still have a good general idea of what to do so I'd just have to learn the route again. On the other side, for GTA4 I'd be better off if I played the game casually some more first. HL2ep2 I know the route and am fairly competent at performing it, I just need to do some runs where I don't mess it up.

Know where YOU are on the chart, and you too will soon become better!

Well there's obviously the 'you can do stuff however you want' thing in 100%

100% doesnt do satchel strats for AE. The mission is affected by car/bike AI accuracy like AHITH, so by taking a bike which 100% has at that point anyway the guards are a non-issue.

I had skipped the cutscene a few times in the past while routing 100% and messing about, but I didn't know what caused it. It struck me all of a sudden that it is maybe caused by failing the mission, so I went away and tested it.

Seems like if you fail the mission, even before having seen the cutscene, the game thinks you've already seen the cutscene and lets you skip it. Can just shoot Ryder's gas tank to quickly fail the mission. There might be other missions that work the same.

Not sure if that was my current PB Powdinet or one of them, but yes that is correct

I abstain from voting