I think it's time we added a Gamecube Emulator category to the RE2 leaderboards. RE3 has one, i think this board needs one. It's the best version to play in my opinion and a lot more people have shown interest in running it. The dolphin emulator runs perfectly, no noticeable performance issues.
Given that I am currently looking into running PSX Emulator which takes a bunch of time to complete, I'd give the GC Emu a try if there is a cat for it :)
I am interested in that, would be on board running it!
~PM
+1 for this. Since RE3 has one and we'd rather not see all those cutscenes again. Kappa
But if everyone just runs on Dolphin than there should be no problem right? Since everyone will get the same speed/performance?
And you can show inputs trough Dolphin just like PSXjin :D
If you can prove with specific settings/configuration for Dolphin that it is stable enough to run RE2 then I don't see why it should be a problem. Cutscene skip is a huge deal and I think it's worth looking into it.
Thanks Furry, I really appreciate you taking the time to look at this objectively.
Zenix, thank you. Providing i can find a stable settings/emulator i will revisit this in the future.
Trance, If we are looking at it like that, why is there a RE3 gamecube emu category if RE3 has PC?
I only read a couple of the posts.
My opinion on categories is well known. Yes, people do have problems with PC version of RE2. But instead of trying to fix the problem, they go to another version. Coincidentally, the PC version has the best runs (apart from Claire A PS1). Then when they do a scrubby run and say it is a WR, half the viewers don't know any difference and it makes them look better than they actually are. PSP version is pretty optimised as well, but after that, nah.
PC version of RE1 is shite and not usable. RE2/3 are the best versions of the game and the most fairest/accessible. I'm not an emu hater, it is just that RE2 has a perfectly fine PC version. some people
Clix has the best runs of RE1, but that game has the same problem. People duck and weave the emu version because they can't get a wr in the emu version.
None of the top runners have dedicated enough time to a verion outside of the pc version other than pyman and the PSP version for it to be classed as a wr. PC is still more optimised than PSP
Trance, your argument is irrelevant to what we're discussing. Furthermore, you're failing to offer a solution to those that cant solve the issues with the PC version. On top of that, you're mocking them because of that . . .
If the times aren't optimised in other categories, why haven't the likes of you competed against the people you have just disregarded as bad runners?
Why are you so against adding something that is already implemented in RE3?
People are simply petitioning for an emulated Gamecube board and what requirements need to be met to establish one. If those conditions cannot be fulfilled then that's understandable. There's no harm for such a request unless there happens to be a lack of interest and activity to maintain it . As I said before, not everyone wants to run the PC version or even has to. Players will choose to compete on whatever platform that is accessible to them and play without issues.
This isn't a matter of avoiding a board that has already been optimized to its full potential. We're asking to increase the playing field for others that have an interest on the GameCube through emulation. Some people don't have the privilege of being able to run physical hardware like others, hence why they lean towards emulators.
And to be fair, the only thing PC has going for it are door skips, but the gameplay remains virtually the same across all platforms. Aside from NTSC vs NTSC-J having differences with damage values, enemy placement, AI behavior with zombies, etc. So, a player's performance wouldn't vary much in comparison to PC except for the IGT.
I definitely understand and agree with the addition of new categories creates an even more messy layout. I wish the boards were organized and laid out in a more visually appealing fashion. Trying to navigate is cumbersome when there's consoles and emulators in the same field. Creating a spreadsheet would be nice, but require effort and time to organize it. If it were to be a group effort, I would suggest letting select people have access to editing it to avoid any tampering. It's not to replace these boards by any means. I'd be willing to actually do a spreadsheet for one of the games. You could easily color code each category and have it easily distinguishable for people to see.
Jaybone, do you have a Wii? Let's get down to the root of it, and be completely honest: why don't you want to play it on console itself when there's plenty of competition? Looking at the progression of the thread from the beginning, you started this thread, and others joined in because it "seemed like a good idea". It sounds to me like you just don't know how to run NTSC games on a PAL Wii (or are simply unwilling to buy the game on console).
There's literally a ton of options for you to choose from if you wanted to play the game and there is no reason to create more categories simply because you are unaware of how to find a solution.
PAL Dreamcast runs at 60Hz. You could import a PS2. You could buy a PSP-3000 for cheap, hack it, install the ISOs (or shit, buy them off PSN), and hook it up with composite cables. You could burn a Gamecube disc and run it on a hacked Wii like ArcadiaSkies did. Gecko OS or other bootloader homebrew Wii apps do this quite easily.
The reason the emulator categories are there to begin with is to allow an easy "low entry barrier", wherein the PSX emulator is the only emulator that can directly compete with an official Sony console.
"RE3 has a GCN emu category so why can't we" is not a good enough reason. That category is on the RE3 boards because the RE3 community don't want to get rid of it, even though I've insisted multiple times. They want it for the Dios-Mios, particularly because some people still didn't want to (or were unable) to buy an actual disc copy of RE3. As a matter of fact, I plan to revisit getting rid of the GCN emu/Dios-Mios category with the RE3 community because:
- RE1-3 don't need any more categories than they already have, especially since Dolphin is seriously not a stable emulator yet like the PSX emulators are.
- We should be striving to play on official consoles (or as close to official releases as possible) because they are accurate.
- Burning discs is still an option.
- Dolphin is not accurate for speedruns yet. To be fair to the point Limburger brought up, it can TAS, but TASes are still just movies and not accurate representations of speedrunning.
If you have consoles, then let's find a solution for you, and get you running NTSC. I can tell you like, immediately jumped from "I'm having this problem" to "I demand this solution" without any in-between (which usually starts with you telling us the problem you are having), so I'd like to know where your head is and if we can help you before you gotta stir the pot.
This not only goes for you, but for every other PAL region user who liked your initial post. Like, Roofress is NTSC so it's apparent finding a solution is not his issue (although it's apparent he wants to help) but everyone else who chipped in is from Europe. This is clearly a problem, but not one that requires us to jump to creating a whole new category just because knowledge isn't directly shared.
That isn't the root of the issue. The root of this issue is not having fair categories that are somewhat consistent across the series. Furthermore to that, not everyone can afford to buy consoles and imports of the game. This essentially, is a pay to compete since biohazard is the fasted and easiest run. As you already know carci, i am from the UK, you already removed Gamecube PAL from the categories because there wasn't enough interest. Instead of removing a demographic, why not remove something that no one actually runs like ext 1, 2, 3 or hunk?
We shouldn't disregard a demographic, interest or no interest. There will always be someone that wants to start running it.
I would like to emphasis that i and most others don't have the luxury of spending hundreds of dollars to import particular consoles and games. They're increasingly becoming more expensive. This is why i'm eager to push for Gamecube emu.
Well equally, that isn't a good enough reason not to add it. Read what people previously said, there is a lot of interest in the category. That also implies there will be a lot of competition . As we all know, it can be tedious to watch cut-scenes. The accessibility of this version and fact that new comers can focus on learning, rather than being frustrated with watching cut scenes over and over is a huge advantage.
The reason i jumped on the "I'm having this problem" to "I demand this solution" is because more than once people have made sensible category suggestions in the forums, and a mod has literally responded with "play PC version". PC isn't the 'be all' of categories, it also has its problems. If you're going to mock people for not being able to run/compete because they cant get it to work, either provide a solution, or don't mock them at all. In fact, don't mock people without reason.
I still stand by my argument, the community have shown interest, why hasn't it been implemented considering RE3 has it?
Both Furry and Zenix have both suggested/implied that this would be fine providing i can (we can) find stable results. This category wouldn't be added unless i could find those results, so what's the harm? Zenix had a perfect attitude towards this. Unfortunately, i think there is a wider issue at hand that i don't wish to pursue for a variety of reasons. I think most people would agree if i said that these forums are toxic.
Also, Thank you for filling me in on some interesting info, i was not aware that modding a wii to that extent was allowed. 'the community' hasn't remotely explained this in an efficient way.
Either way, i have fun speedrunning without necessarily being recognised as 'legit' by speedrun.com on RE2. I plan to route RE3 seeing as it does have an EMU category.
I would like point something out. Although i disagree with how this is being handled, in no way do i hold this personally towards anyone. No real outcome or compromise can be made, so feel free to close this thread off.
I might be wrong here but does it really matter if Dolphine is unreliable? as far as i know all RE2 versions are timed by IGT so why would it matter?
Contradition: Personally I hold the view that emulators should only be used for practice and only the official versions should have a leaderboard. I live in a PAL country and i know how shit it is so i play the PC version for RE2/3. IF you dont wanna play the PC version then your only option would be for example import a console (which i have for Zelda alttp) or mod your current one. If its to expensive and you wanna speedrun for quite a while then you should start saving up.
Im not trying to insult anyone but thats my personal view.
Now, I want everybody to be happy in this so called community so im all for GCN EMU as long as the EMU is fair between those runners.
EDIT: btw who's up for adding the game.com version of RE2 as a category? Kappa
i personally don't agree with dolphin emu but buying a wii for £20 and bootloading the game so no imports i do agree with. If i didn't play the PC version or a PC version didn't exist i would want to do the same, but only because PAL sucks else i would be on the disc copy.
A wii is £20 & an SD capture card is £5. YEP £5 on amazon. i bought one and it works fine.
So spending £25 is nothing as i'm sure most people have a donation button on their stream and get money that way, and if people are dedicated enough to speedrunning this game it's really not a lot of money.
RE3 has a GC emu category but the boards for each category has a maximum on 3 people and all runs are done on a wii via bootloader as its more reliable, stable ect. But that leaderboard is dead. If the re2 category ended up like that then there's really no point. I've seen one person running GC Emu and that's jaybone. may be more but that's all I've seen. (i don't mean any disrespect to be clear.)
if an re2 gc emu category was added how active would it be? and how long for? i think that's one of the biggest reasons why the idea of the category being added is being shot down so quickly. that and dolphin really hasn't been tested. If anything i would say get rid of Dreamcast and N64 categories they aren't active and probably never will be, a gc emu(bootload) category could be added in their place. solves the problem of clutter since they are dead categories anyway. i highly disagree with removing hunk, however. trance alone spent 6 months going for that time it may not be highly active but its hell of an achievement for someone up to the challenge. as many have done already.
Also don't take any offence to anything i've said, please. no disrespect or anything to anyone. Just my opinions.
Limburger10 makes a good point here. If we allow GCN EMU now while RE2 is still hot from all the remake hype we might get alot of new runners. Plus the new runners would probably want the fastest RTA version.
and when we've gathered all the new runners we'll delete the leaderboard and make them change to PC Kappa
When Capcom releases new shiny updated ports of RE2 and 3 on digital platforms then you'll have all the right to push new people into running ONLY on PC, until then, let people play the games on whatever the fuck they want, since they're running the SAME game and there are more differences across US/JPN versions than between actual platforms. If they ever want to switch to a faster platform for HIGH-LEVEL COMPETITION, they'll do it eventually.
If you keep bringing the same "BUT THIS OLD BAREBONES PC PORT IS FASTER AND YOU SHOULD PLAY THAT HUEHUEHUE" in every single thread people will hate (or keep hating) this community.
Call it low-entry barrier or whatever, but if there's a LOT of people asking for X category because they believe it would make sense, then they deserve to be listened to and talk about the topic at hand, not PC stuff.
