Forums  /  Mario Kart series  /  Mario Kart 8  /  Bringing Video Requirements up again because I'm concerned
  AeonFrodoAeonFrodo

So Videowiz brought up this 8 months ago - http://www.speedrun.com/mk8/thread/y36ov/1#x1f6h and it appeared that the community agreed for that to be a thing. And now it's happened again with 2 runs that have been accepted into the top 5 in 150cc and 200cc categories.

I believe the agreement that happened was if a runner had a top 5 time they had to show video proof, along with splits (either screenshoted or on the stream). I'm not attacking anybody, but I am concerned that if somebody beats the WR of either categories, and considering the two runs that have been accepted, we're going to have a WR on the leaderboards without video proof if the runner abides by the rules that were set.

So, I'm suggesting we need to have the video requirements uniform across all categories, so that everybody in the community is happy to abide by them

 
  AeonFrodoAeonFrodo

I'm not sure why you responded to this considering you don't own or speedrun the game, but one of the rules that is that you have to do the category on Hard Mode CPU.

So let's say one person does a 32 track run at 150cc, and manages to get a decent time. However without video proof or a screenshot of the gameplay there is no proof whether the runner did a run with the Hard Mode CPU on. Which is why the runners who have top times show that VS mode screen as proof that they are sticking to the rules set out by the community.

 
  Videowiz92Videowiz92

I'm glad you brought this up Aeon, and this needs to change. Same thing with your thread you brought up http://www.speedrun.com/mk8/thread/guja5 where someone got a submission through with Frantic Mode instead of Regular Items and it was brushed away. Back then my concerns in my thread from 8 months ago was mainly about the possibility of someone faking times to get that edge on a record but I hadn't even thought about the fact that we all capture the Vs. Settings screen to verify we follow the community guidelines for the runs.

I haven't been speed running this game in a long time and it crossed my mind to try to beat my records again and compete for best times. But seriously what's the point now that there are multiple runs accepted that either flat out don't follow those rules posted for the community to follow or don't even show proof of it in the first place.

 
  LafungoLafungo

Quote

I believe the agreement that happened was if a runner had a top 5 time they had to show video proof, along with splits (either screenshoted or on the stream).

I don't follow this community too closely, so I don't have much input to give overall, but I am curious as to why showing splits should matter at all if a run has video proof.

 
  AeonFrodoAeonFrodo

I wasn't there 8 months ago in the community, but I believed splits were mentioned. I think I just interpreted that part incorrectly when reading the thread.

 
  pizza_rlpizza_rl

@AeonFrodo There are two reasons I can't show proof of my runs. 1. I don't have the right kind of pc for splits, I just use my phone. 2. I don't have the right tools for streaming.

I do believe your point about how wr runs should have video proof, but if they have a capture card for their phone, those splits would work, right? I can't stream my attempts, so if i had a camera, that could be ok. I could make a youtube video of the run with out splits, so if you could see my point, thank you for your patronage. Also, good luck with your runs.

 
  VincentWeirVincentWeir

Well, I do have an iPad for recording my runs, but they can only go for a limited amount of time (1 - 1/4 hour)...

 
  AeonFrodoAeonFrodo

I was talking about top 5 times should require video proof, not anybody outside those times, which was something people agreed upon 8 months ago when that thread was made. And recently two runs that claimed to have top 5 times, one in 150cc category, and one in 200cc, had been accepted by the moderators of this leaderboard without video proof, which shouldn't happen under that agreement.

I understand it's frustrating for people who don't have the means to capture or can't capture the entire run, but it's better to try to save up some money, invest in a capture card or any device that can record for longer periods of time before embarking on a run that might be lost, otherwise people are going to be very skeptical if you actually got the time you achieved.

Like I mentioned earlier, the run has to be done on Hard Mode CPU, and people who have provided video proof show the entry screen on VS mode because it's the only way that you can show you're abiding by the rules of the community. So by the mods accepting a time that's in the top 5 without video proof, it's actually frustrating for the runners who have proven they have abided by the ruleset, because they have invested in buying a capture card, spending time to improve their time and providing proof for the moderators to look over. I heard that 2 people in the top 5 who do want to improve their times, but now don't want to anymore because they don't trust the moderators are checking over the runs and are abiding by the agreement that was made 8 months ago.

And I feel like that trust has broken between me and the moderators as well, but I will still be submitting times in good faith the moderation team will be checking my run to see if I'm abiding by the rules in place. When I first ran this game back in September, I was under the belief that you need a video for a top 5 time because of this agreement, because it was the only way you can show that you've done the category with Hard Mode CPUs. That was my understanding which was how video proof worked.

Again, if I sound like I'm attacking the people running this, I apologise, but I don't believe it's your fault. I'm speaking up because the moderation team have broken an agreement that was made with the community 8 months ago, and broken trust between the community and the moderators does not reflect well with the community.

 
  SnipinG117SnipinG117

When I was chosen as mod, and even before that I was a mod, I was always told that only WR times would need video proof, this was more than a year ago. For this my reasoning for accepting Top 5 times without proof. I do however always check a run with video proof no matter what to see if they applied the correct ruleset since we don't want someone using frantic mode (which is not allowed as of now) or normal difficulty for example.

I do like to address (but this is my personal opinion) that it looks like that some people care to much about placement on the leaderboards and having a Top 5 ranked time rather than caring caring about their own personal improvement (again, I might mistake this assumption, but it just looks like this from some discussions I have seen over the months).

Do keep in mind that I try to check the background of the runners, as of lately some TT'ers are getting into speedrunning aswell. I follow the TT's everyday so if a very skilled TT'er submits a run that is Top 5, I am very well aware that he posesses the nessecery kill to accomplish a time like that.

Again, if you are held back by the fact that people get Top 5 times without the nessecary proof and you feel discouraged by that, that personally I think that your mindset for speedrunning is a bit of. For me, it has always been about my own improvement and not about having a Top 5 time on a leaderboard. This is all my opinion, you may disagree with that.

Now, as I do think that a certain group of people feel that Top 5 times should require the nessecary video proof, this might discourage people who don't posess the tools to record a video, since Wii U capture software might be expensive to some people (Not everyone is of an age in this community to be able to buy it themselves) but then again, it might also encourage them to invest in streaming/recording soft-/hardware.

I am aware of what the people above think about Top 5 times needing proof, including video proof, but it would be nice to know what other might think of this. As a moderator I have simpely followed the ruleset of moderation that was applied on here and the leaderboards before speedrun.com, which was: WR times require proof.

 
  AeonFrodoAeonFrodo

My issue is that there was an agreement made 8 months ago that there was video proof needed for top 5 times, and this was before I came into the Mario Kart 8 speedrunning scene, where I still only care about improving my time and getting the best I can possibly achieve through my own abilities.

Yes WR times need more proof than just a time, but when you have your own moderation team agreeing to something that happened 8 months ago and the moderation team does not reflect the agreement made between the community and the moderation team, this affects the mindsets of the runners who have been around back then who talked to the team and that they were happy to agree to this. I have provided proof of this agreement as well in the opening post of this thread, plus have provided reasons why accepting runs without video proof in the top 5 is a bad idea.

To blame me (and maybe other runners) who had that sort of mindset when going through the forum posts to triple check the rules and see if there were any extra requirements for this game is utterly disgusting and people in the moderation team have accepted times even though they are breaking this agreement and the members of this community have not been notified of this change. Let's get this straight, people's mindsets have been affected by that thread 8 months ago, not the other way around. I've been making a meticulous effort to make sure I stay on that VS. settings menu screen for long enough so that mods can see I've been sticking to the rules when I know I'm around the top 5 time or getting a top 5 time, otherwise I was afraid my run wouldn't be accepted because of those rules in place that I put time in researching.

 
  SnipinG117SnipinG117

Alright, starting today: Top 5 runs will require video proof, for all categories (150cc and 200cc). Mods team agreed on the stated requirement.