Hello, I'm one of the mod team involved with the Street Fighter Speedrun discord community and also a leaderboard mod for many other various Street Fighter communities. I would like to appear as a representative of our discord's mod team and express our thoughts and feelings for a moment while I help expand a bit on our structure and purpose within the general street fighter speedrun community itself.

[big]Firstly,[/big] I think it's important to recognise how our mod team is established and why the discord exists; the Street Fighter Speedrun discord is not some random fan-effort, it was formed as a direct extension of the official SRC leaderboards serving as a general hub for all Street Fighter related speedrun games - our mod team is simply the combined moderators of every Street Fighter game listed on SRC with an active community; I myself started out as the admin for SFV together with GingerSocrates as my co-mod before we too were brought into the fold and we still carry out those duties today. SF2 is the only community that is the exception to all this because of Andy's unwillingness to cooperate with our combined local hub.

To quickly clarify when we talk of "The SF Community" we don't just mean Hyper Fighting or SFIITurbo but all the official derivatives of the game and their officially associated SRC pages - that being the following...

Street Fighter (1986) Street Fighter Alpha - Warriors' Dreams Street Fighter Alpha 2 Street Fighter Alpha 3 Street Fighter III: 2nd Impact Super Gem Fighter: Mini Mix Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike Street Fighter III: New Generation Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix Ultra Street Fighter IV Street Fighter V: Champion Edition Ultra Street Fighter II: The Final Challengers Hyper Street Fighter II

Additionally, of the above list only those below are currently unassociated with our discord in an official capacity which is only the case because of Andy's unwillingness to cooperate with the wider SF community as a whole.

Street Fighter II - The World Warrior Street Fighter II' - Champion Edition Street Fighter II' Turbo: Hyper Fighting Super Street Fighter II - The New Challengers Super Street Fighter II Turbo

[big]Secondly,[/big] There have been many times in the past where people have made the extra effort to go outside our established collective hub and attempt to raise concerns with Andy in the forums but would be met with a response that either doesn't actually address the concerns with an appropriate solution or would not be addressed at all (these were often the time where Andy would mention he didn't get the notification) whatever the actual reasons behind this isn't important and I'm not trying to judge Andy on what's happened but it's undeniable at this point that the community does not currently feel like their concerns are properly listened to when they approach Andy with a problem.

When someone has a problem they come to our discord because they know they're not going to be ignored like they would be on the forums and we have a rich track record of being able to solve many issues in the past because of our strong collective of mods from different street fighter related backgrounds with whom we can share and discuss problems within the community for example there may be similar situations with different SF games for a certain problem where they have expertise on the issue that another community does not such as how the SFIII community was able to uncover that the Anniversary Collection is infact not Arcade Perfect and so because of that a solution has been devised to accommodate this finding from game to game based on a case-by-case basis depending on platform performance and if they too turn out to also not be Arcade Perfect - an example that was pointed out here in the SSFIITurbo SRC forums over 3 months ago and has been subsequently ignored ever since - another example of the community feeling like they're not being heard when they bring up concerns with you.

[big]Thirdly,[/big] I'd like to touch on your unwillingness to use Discord.

Our discord has existed for many years now already; it exists because of the many active SF communities that we represent it was agreed that to use the forums as the sole form of communication is folly when the game you're moderating has a billion different iterations - having a central hub like ours is what helps give your community form and help people have a central platform to share their voice.

To further help illustrate the point I would like to present an exert of a conversation that happened on the discord when our members were asking about why Andy isn't collaborating with the rest of us to help you understand the broader perspective of the current status quo. Statement is as follows:

My guess is it's the same kind of thing with how some people feel uncomfortable using social media; the big difference here is that the community he's supposed to be moderating for uses Discord as it's primary communication tool - it's not just stubbornness on our part either because this is something that's intrinsically linked to many, many other SRC communities to the point where it's seen as the norm these days; this is exactly the reason why SRC themselves support a Discord link in the sidebar.

Heck, even both the OoT and SM64 community where I originally started out both see the SRC forums as a joke in comparison because for really big communities it's imperative to have a single local hub to discuss issues pertaining to all derivatives of that game at the same time otherwise it becomes very chaotic when trying to solve issues that come up and this is what we're currently seeing with the community concerns in regards to the SF2 leaderboards.

I understand Andy probably feels like he's doing the right thing by taking a stance on his unwillingness to utilise it, but he's failing to acknowledge the overall state of the community by doing so.

[big]Finally,[/big] I hope you can understand with all I've said so far that the community concerns are not about you specifically but about the overall status quo of the SF2 leaderboards and the state of it's moderation and as such should not be treated as a personal attack but rather an opportunity for collabration to fix the many issues yet waiting to be resolved.

I'd like to say this clearly so it can't be misunderstood; if you yourself refuse to use Discord then we believe there should be a single representative of our mod team that is able to mediate for you as an additional SRC leaderboard mod in your stead in order to answer the concerns we are receiving about the leaderboard. It would be against the SRC guidelines to simply dismiss the concerns of the overall SF community because you yourself are not in know and are unwilling to learn and it is our hope that some measure of collabration can come to pass.

Post Edited for correct bbcode formatting.

Under the new moderation of @NerdyNester, @Tenka, @Spriven, @Habble and @DustyTokyo the rule changes for the Street Fighter Alpha 2 leaderboards have now been completed! Please find below a detailed list of all the changes.

• Discord community intergration has been added to the sidebar

• INP File intergration for WolfMAME submissions has been added Submissions using WolfMame may submit a valid INP file of the run instead of requiring the emulator window to be captured

• General Rules for all platforms have been redesigned and clarified for consistency

• Clarified timing start and end inconsistencies

• Clarified many config inconsistencies accross all platforms

• Permitted Emulators have been updated

• Submissions made using Smartphone Emulators are now universally banned

• Submissions made using Flash Cartidges on real hardware are now universally allowed

• All official releases of the game are now allowed including Alpha 2 Gold and it's JP counterpart, Zero 2 Alpha. A full list of gameplay changes and selectable secret characters can now be found in Game Rules

• Secret Characters are now universally allowed Shin Akuma is the only exception to this who now has his own category until we can ascertain if he's too broken in runs to compete with the regular cast members

• New "PC" category and it's associated platform has been added This new platform references the downloadable port from GOG

• New "PS5" platform for the 30th Anniversary port has been added

• New "3DSVC" sub-category for the SNES port has been added
• The previously sole existing category has been renamed "Max Damage"
• New "Default" category for all platforms
• New "Expert" category for all platforms
• New "Survival Mode" misc category for the Arcade platform
• New "Dramatic Battle" misc category for the Arcade platform (Can be done Solo or Co-Op
• New "Shin Akuma Challenge" misc category for the Arcade platform
• New "MAXIMUM ALPHA" misc category for Playstation, Saturn and PC platforms • Many previously rejected runs have now been overturned and re-verified into their respective new categories

Thankyou everyone for your paitence as we continue to grow our community and we look forward to seeing all your speedruns to come!

You don't even need to understand the game to know this run should never have been verified, let alone accepted at all - that's what this has come to now. If questionable moderator choices like this were a one time occurance I'd be quick to dismiss it but we've already seen a history of repeated neglect and apathy for a long time now and tbh it's just beyond a joke at this point.

I feel like It's clear that something needs to change and I'd like to remain optimisitc that perhaps with a new moderation direction that could be achieved. I look forward to seeing how the situation will resolve.

So there are three different versions 1.0 - The original release US and JP disk (Back holo code 0-00) 1.1 - PAL Disk (Lacks access to JP Text and 480p output) 1.1 - The US Player's Choice Disk (Back holo code 0-01)

There's not much difference gameplay wise between region/versions, there are no major glitches locked to a particular version either.

The NTSC game copies actually have data for both English and JP text on them which changes automatically based on your console's detected region (which can be manipulated via Wii Homebrew) so the only version that you can't get JP text on is a PAL disk which has the data on the disk but can't access it since it can't do it's own internal NTSC conversion.

The cutscene speed is a fixed amount specific to the cutscene used rather than being tied to how fast the text scrolls so any overall difference in text speed is only for the gameplay parts where you can mash B through it anyway - sometimes the less overall text in a paragraph batch means less skipping but it's no where near as comparable to a game like OoT where the cutscenes themselves get universally slower.

Because of all this, the fastest to run on is version 1.1 because It has faster loads and a hardcoded 12 second cutscene difference in Dragon rock - beyond that the US 1.1 being able to output in 480p and access to JP text is the gravy ontop which makes it the optimal version.

Yeah it's fine, it's basically the same reason why RGB mods are allowed. If you decide you don't want to bother with looking for a modded US Toploader, the JP Toploader has the AV Ports without modification; the community and Ebay listings generally call that model the AV Famicom.

If you're looking forward to getting your feet wet as soon as you can, you might want to consider starting off with some Spellstone 1 category runs that are kept under the misc tab. It's basically half of Any% so with what you've learnt already it won't be much of a leap to just jump right into it. It gives you a good idea of what to expect from the game to let you know if you want to keep running or not - which can be a surprisngly time consuming investment if you're concerned about category lengths per attempt like I was.

Nice, thanks for that! I just got back from hiatus and have started speedrunning again so I'll see if I can slot in a few runs to get the ball rolling after my current game grinds. c:

No need, testing for SFII Turbo was already done back in 2018 so it's been known for a long time, the ruleset has just never been adjusted to acknowledge the findings - something I've been advocating for a long time.

Edit: I'd like to also add that I don't think a simple category split is the best answer based on these findings as the real issue isn't just that the Anniversary collection is imperfect but that it should be allowed to exist cohesivly as long as it isn't artificially faster beyond what the original game allows - a situation we actually can simulate through selective Turbo speeds. - because of this I feel like it's better to simply ban runs using higher relative levels of speed granted by turbo on the Anniversary Collection which the authentic Arcade version cannot match.

There are also many Anniversary runs on the board listed under the Arcade platform which gives a false impression of authenticity since the Anniversary Collection is not Arcade Perfect - I think that should be changed to reflect it's differences.

Has there been any progress on discussions for this? I would really like to see how the community wants to grow with these ideas since it seems like there's alot of interest out there still.

My 2 cents is that any category added would have to be non-rotating; as fun as it would be to compare Abyss times or limited-time event bosses for example there isn't much objective point in temporary challenges like that if you can't repeat them under the same conditions. I also don't think it's a good idea to segregate sub categories based on whaling limiutations but I'm sure that's a much larger discussion to have.

Edit: Regarding that last point, I never realised there were already existing restrictions on using wish characters so just disregard that thought.

NokiDoki, the Super Mod for SD Sunshine CE made a response to that here https://www.speedrun.com/smsce/thread/u937m but didn't elaborate on why so I'm not sure what the reasoning behind it is.

No problem, good catch!

Yes, that's not a problem. Personally, I like only submitting those runs to the CE leaderboard so I can track my rate of progress by route alot easier but you are allowed to submit to both if you want.

I'd wager that's a maaaaaaybe but if it ever did exist it would prob better belong in a category extension board.

It may also be considered for category extensions if the mods decide to make their own leaderboard dedicated to 3D All-Stars

I dounno about that personally, alot of the categories that exist in the SM64 Extension boards arn't even possible on the Switch and it feels really arkward to be given an option to submit to a category with a platform that isn't capable of following it's requirements.

I think it would make more sense to have the 3D All Stars community create their own extensions board that eliminates all confusion between the different intricacies each game has compared to it's original release - not to mention that would work better for the Galaxy community as it seems like Switch may become the ideal way to play for them in a harmonised leaderboard.

Just because something has been done with TAS doesn't make it viable in a real run. Infact, that's the whole point of TAS strats. That's not to say there isn't a very small chance something new might be found specifically just for Shindou optimisation - at which point I'm sure they'll add in a sub-70 Star category for it - but don't hold your breath.

If the SM64 community as a whole wanted an "Any%" distinction then SM64 proper would have that instead of the 0 Star category.

I noticed the extra "Lost Episode" DLC chapters featuring Street Fighter cameos arn't on the leaderboard yet which I'd be interested to see as a category to run here. Could those be added?

First, I think it's important to mention that most of the others frequenting this board don't stick around too long and it's usually their first speedgame so gauging a baseline for what a "good" time is can be far more difficult at a glance than you might first realise; there's still alot of untapped potential for non-Emu runs since I'm really the only one that's hard grinded every main level so far but I don't have an Android phone myself.

Sadly the game hasn't been avalible on iOS for over a year since it got taken off the Apple Store, it looks like we only ever had a single ioS submission 2 years ago as well so if there ever was a category split I think just doing Native vs Emulator is fine. If that change makes it to the boards I'd also like to see it for both full-game and IL's.

Now, I've done alooooot of Emu runs so I'll try to mention the most important stuff I've found. Firstly, the Android emulator itself (I used Bluestacks) actually isn't faster at all but it does have some inherant advantages; assumably because of how the controls were ported, especially after rebinding them for comfort.

• Acceleration RNG Normally there is a surprising amount of RNG present in the Fox's acceleration and momentum which is really the core problem with platform comparability; it's essentially possible to eliminate the RNG with the natural consistency that Emu can grant by how much easier it is to mash compared to the normal Tap/Touch control scheme on the phone glass.

There's actually potential for Android to be RNG-free as well so lemme be a bit more specific on how it works.

On Emu, the keyboard is considered a controller as well and for some reason pressing either A or D nudges the Fox forward; an alternating mash between these keys can be combined with normal movement in order to achieve more overall movement consistency - It's been my suspicion for awhile that simillar movement options probabbly exists for real hardware without being mentioned in the tutorial - but without an Android myself I can't test that. I really hope there is because that means we wouldn't even need a category split, Android would be able to compete against Emu easily with this tech.

• The game's physics engine is tied to framerate. I did some tests awhile back where I used my high-end CRT with a refresh rate of 160hz to play the game in 160fps with some halariously broken results. It's not that big of a deal since I let Grantolant know and we implemented the 60fps lock rule but the biggest concern with this is that it's potentially not just an emulator thing; I havn't been able to confirm this myself yet but theoretically if you had say, a Razor Android Phone that can do 120fps or simillar, you would see this behaviour in natural play as well.

It's also important to mention that changes in the Fox's speed based on framerate is also true in reverse; if your Emulator or Phone starts dropping frames for whatever reason, the fox will lose speed.

Here's links to those tests I did on my 160hz CRT that I mentioned earlier. Freakin' halarious. You can see in these clips that the extra speed from the increased framerate only activates 3secs into the stage (note how the Ghost Fox actually keeps pace with me until then) which leads me to believe that the entire 3secs is the natural "end point" of the initial acceleration RNG you usually see that we're subjected to at the start of every level.

• TL;DR Please let me know if you need clarifications on anything I've mentioned; personally I'd be fine with a category split but I also don't think anyone has put in the work to actually get an optimal non-Emu time yet. If anyone else has an Android and is able to confirm the movement tech I mentioned earlier or anything else please let us know. c:

That's a good point actually, this will be the first itteration of these games where Nintendo can patch anything they want post-sale - IIRC downpatching is possible but not very intuitive for the Switch? I'm not too familliar with it myself but I heard it's a pain. I'd be surprised if they plan to do any kind of patches if they keep up the whole limited-time physical+digital sale thing though, they don't seem to committed to the idea of supporting the collection release long term.

If one does not already exist, I would love to see it made! Both myself and a friend of mine were thinking of picking up the game to run