Yeah magnum rule makes sense. Does this mean same for mup though? Or is MUP even allowed.

For HC that gun is not too op since it won't stagger normal zombies 1 shot to the head

I would think if MAG is allowed, no shop should be allowed. MAG should be enough to keep it as a New game. Fresh account style.

Standard is just possible to do with g19+upgrades thanks to deaths adjusting DA to a difficulty that allows you to have enough ammo to the end. Hardcore definitely isnt possible.

Im going to mess around with the crafting companion later.

Finished a MUP run and it was not enjoyable. Gun is so weak/boosts DA.

Not a 100% sure where, leading up to the 2nd hunter showing up or after you kill it the game is on a timer. So it doesnt matter what you do until then. Seems you can just stun the zombies and not touch them until clean up(after killing 2nd hunter) That just adds an unnecesary hassle though. I notice the traps can kill the zombies over time. I shoot the traps but you can dodge into them as well. Safer to shoot.

I'm guessing only hg runs should allow using knife to break wooden boxes since the pistol ammo is so scarce?

Well you can use rounds to open the crates as well so idk how that rule will be affected

The amount of boxes with a chance of ammo is almost a clip. Allowing the knife to break boxes would be very helpful in ammo reservation. If the difference between those bullets was a deathless run on standard I would say use the knife, but I dont think it is.

The knife shouldn't be allowed in HG only. Unless someone else can do hardcore and up without the unlimited HG, I think that would be the go to gun on hardcore and above. It's still a challenge run at that point. Yes you could get a bunch of healing items and power through, but that wouldn't be fastest. It will eventually boil down to as few heals as possible to save the most time. It would really rely on dodging skill and movement to see who gets to the top.

I would leave the rule open when it comes to handgun use. MUP, samurai edge, g18, g19+upgrades. Possibly MAG if thats a thing.

For Assisted/standard samurai edge is quickest(quicker than MUP), even with gathering ammo. Mixture of Samurai edge, g18 and g19 would make Hardcore tolerable I dont think MUP would cut it. I dont even know what kind of handgun Ammo nightmare/inferno has. Gunpowder makes 10 bullets on hardcore, who knows about nightmare/inferno.

For MAG its 2rounds per mix on Inferno. I'd assume it's the worst for HG ammo

The base handguns, starter, carlos', and mag should be the only ones in standard/assisted since shop guns aren't necessary. If the samurai edge can make hardcore possible then it should be used instead of unlimited hg.

I thought rules had to be universal through out all difficulties. Meaning hardcore+ would have the same rules as assisted/standard. If rules can be separate per difficulty thats cool.

Im guessing gunpowder makes 5-6 bullets on inferno then.

@kniferunkniferun RE2 Standard Knife Only had non unlimited Knife but Hardcore had Unlimited Knife. So if needed the Rules can be different for difficulties. But I assume anymore then 2 different rulesets for difficulties could be an issue. So Assisted/Standard should be the same at least and Hardcore+ could be different.

Right, I forgot about that. I think Standard should be thrown in to the same rule pool as HC+ though as you are basically forced to die multiple times to get through. you could probably get through HC with the same rules as assisted/standard if you die enough on purpose depending on the DA floor on HC.

Especially if you can use the MAG.

Well i feel if u can use the MAG u can def do Assisted-Hardcore w/o Shop Items. And it would still be faster to do Assisted (and maybe Standard) w/o MAG most likely as the time to grab Mag would prob not be worth it. But I wonder if even w/ MAG u can beat Nightmare/Inferno w/o Shop Items.

Alright, so I'm going to put forth some rules and lets discuss and compromise if necessary.

I don't believe that standard should use anything NG+. Yeah DA manip is annoying, but unless it's really necessary I don't think NG+ guns should be allowed. Hardcore will never fall below 8 DA, so I don't think that it's going to be as necessary to manip.

All general rules apply to this category.

Assisted/Standard: Use of the starting handgun, Burst handgun, and Magnum is allowed. All shop items are banned.

Hardcore: Use of the starting handgun, Burst handgun, and Magnum is allowed. Use of the Samurai Edge handgun is allowed. All other shop items are banned.

Nightmare/Inferno: Use of the starting handgun, Burst handgun, and Magnum is allowed. Use of the Samurai Edge handgun and the Infinite Handgun are allowed. All other shop items are banned.

If 8 DA is the floor for HC there wont be any Manipulation, when it comes to Ammo shortage anyways, maybe to make certain situations easier if needed. That'll probably go for nightmare/inferno as well.

I can say rules for assisted/standard and hardcore are perfect. Havent touched nor do I plan to touch nightmare/inferno so I cant really throw any input on those.

I honestly believe that nightmare/inferno are not do able with the amount of ammo in the game. Even with the unlimited HG, its still going to be a huge challenge to finish.

I'll wait a bit for others to give feedback before I talk to the other mods about this. I'm glad to see us coming together to set up some rules.

HC without a way to free up some locations of zombies and so on is pretty crazy. Nightmare and inferno will be nuts, although every single run currently on the nightmare/inferno NG leaderboard is nuts. So who knows.

Wish there was a way to get some feedback from a majority that will attempt to run this. Theres always more then those who post on the forum or discord.

I'll give a run for this for sure. The run that was posted does it have a set route for gunpowder and such? I havent gotten to watching the video yet so I dont know much besides the rules posted

That's the step after getting it on the board haha, routing. I'm going to bring this up to the other mods now. Still feel free to give input on the rules I wrote out if anything doesn't seem right.

Literally on standard every bullet needs to be picked up, up until magnum, After that is a toss up. Do you Manip DA and continue collecting all ammo or pick up MAG and change it up a bit. Assisted is alot less ammo gathering. I think with more practice possibly the MAG will be around the same. Standard should be faster with MAG.

SpeedIdol has both posted here, with(deathless) and without(death manip) MAG. I dont think he had it optimized just seeing if it could be done. I could be wrong though.