Forums  /  Resident Evil series  /  Resident Evil 3 (2020)  /  Console type Filter vs Sub Category
  RapixOnGamingRapixOnGaming

Hello everyone, I thought it was a good idea starting a new conversation around this topic which I believe to be important for many. Please Console runners come forward and express you opinion.

Just to explain the current state of art.There are proven differences (advantages/disadvantages) between consoles due to an inherent flaw in the IGT based on frame rate. That's the reason why Mods, after discussing how to represent this difference, decided to create a filter "Console type" with the XboxOneX and PS4Pro being together and all the other versions of the consoles being grouped together. Basically Eighth generation Console vs/or 8.1 Gen. which makes sense because same generation console have the same pro/cons.

What I believe to be wrong is the use of filter rather than a Sub category for many reasons. As proven by Mods, 8th Gen console have a disadvantage vs 8.1 gen. and both will have disadvantage versus 9th. gen. console (PS5/XboxOneSeriesX). This denaturalize the very essence of a leaderboard.

Someone can say, "x amount of categories is enough, new sub-categories make the leaderboard ugly"
The beauty of a leaderbaord is not important and not even the amount of submissions, fairness and compete on a level playing field is what matters. If there is a PS4 runner, it's important he has it's leaderboard to compete equally. Someone competing for WR will never beat a time made on PS5. (It's not only about WR anyway, even the last person in the leaderboard deserves to compete fairly).

Someone can say, "if you want to see who has WR for a particular Console Type you can use the filter", this argument is not valid because if you look the personal page of that runner, its run won't be showed as WR.
Just to make an understandable example, SpeedIdol has the 2nd place on NG Console Hardcore at the moment of writing, he is actually 1st among 8th Gen console, but if you go in his personal page it says 2nd.

If you leave the leaderboard as it is right now, you make this game board a pay to win board. All runs made today are gonna be easily beaten in 8 months when 9th gen console are out, and so people are absolutely wasting their time running this game today.

To make another example, if you leave the board the way it is, it would be the same if you allow infinite FPS on PC, the decision to force a cap of 120FPS is exactly to maintain a level playing field. If there wasn't that cap people with the best most expensive computer would win, this is what's happening on console right now. It's sadly a pay to win. Don't look the leaderboard today, in few weeks it will stabilize with PS4PPo/XboxOneX at the top and next year will all be PS5/XboxOneSeriesX at the top.

Please consider the Sub Category as an option just like, RE0, RE1o, RE2o, RE3o, RE4 and many other games.

kibowmankibowman, Blucker12Blucker12 and 4 others like this. 
  kniferunkniferun

The difference between 60 and 120 is much bigger than base ps4 and ps4pro. The difference is only a dozen(give or take) fps opposed to 60 fps difference between 60 and 120. PC hasnt made any complaints. The difference between consoles is seconds, if that, since loading times arent counted towards IGT. So its all based on smoothness. I dont think 45 fps is that huge of a difference from 58fps.

PS5 or series x shouldnt be a thought until they are released. Which I still dont think they will make that big of a difference either. Unless an update is released to open up fps beyond 60.

 
  TyRy74--Soulslayer--TyRy74--Soulslayer--

Personally I would rather it all be together like it is now. If I want to sort out who has the best run on PS4/Xbox One S I can and if I want to see Xbox One X/PS4 Pro I can (same as difficulties on NG+). But I don't think the difference is big enough for it to warrant completely separate categories.

 
  RemusRemus

This is a fair point i think, but at the same time im running on a ps4 slim and im ok going up against ps4 pro..But i can see a concern if all top players are ps4 pro..

But if there is a ps4 slim in second then im sure withen a few weeks they can also be better than a pro ps4 time?

Either way im happy 🙂 Just having fun with this speedrun at the moment.

 
  PapicarlosPapicarlos

I'm ok with you Xbox have less frame then PS4 so we need 2 catégory !

 
  TyRy74--Soulslayer--TyRy74--Soulslayer--

@PapicarlosPapicarlos I think that video was made before they patched the Xbox One X version to be as good if not better than PS4 Pro.

 
  kniferunkniferun

xbox one x and ps4 pro are running at the same ish fps now. base ps4 is just abit lower than pro and x. base xbox is at the bottom of the pile.

Before the patch that brought the xbox one x resolution down had it running at base xbox fps. For some reason they thought the xbox x could handle 4k, while leaving the rest of the consoles at 1080.

ps4 pro seems to be more consistent reaching close to 60 continuously though.

ATM the leaderboards arent being dominated by xbox x and ps4 pro. NG+ leader played on base ps4.

The difference would be mere seconds, very non aggressive 2 digits max.

 
  PapicarlosPapicarlos

Oh they patched that ok nice, thanks !

 
  tommy67phamtommy67pham

I experienced the pay to win dilemma in RE2 Remake. I was consistently running Leon B Hardcore for three months until me and my buddy concluded that knife damage is affected by the type of PS4. I was using the Base PS4 and my buddy had the PS4 Pro. At the time (around March 2019), I held 2nd place in my preferred category only to be beaten by DaRKShA (great runner btw) whom was playing on PS4 Pro. I currently play on the PS4 Pro and I completely agree that there should be a category specifically for the stronger consoles.

WanderingPastriesWanderingPastries and RapixOnGamingRapixOnGaming like this. 
  kniferunkniferun

You would have to split base xbox and base ps4 aswell. The difference between base xbox to base ps4 is the same as ps4 to ps4 pro/xbox one x.

Nothing in RE3R is tied to FPS like the knife was in RE2R

 
  ReavezReavez

Has this been confirmed that nothing is tied to fps? i thought there was a mention of the igt and fps having something going on.

ALso i dont run console but i can see console runners that would prefer a split board rather then a filter between the base and pro versions. This has happened in FF7 remake and obviously its a longer run so load times there will have a bigger impact on a run but still.

WanderingPastriesWanderingPastries and RapixOnGamingRapixOnGaming like this. 
  RapixOnGamingRapixOnGaming

It was confirmed by the Mods @kniferunkniferun @Reavez there are advantages/disadvantages depending on Console due to FPS. One of the Mod even posted a table with estimated time save/loss depending on Console. Unfortunately I can't find it anymore. It would be nice if someone re-post that analysis here. Thanks

 
  kniferunkniferun

Pretty sure chart was cutscene bleed. Which was more to display the reason to not use IGT for PC when they planned to use variable FPS. That situation has very little difference comparing 45 fps to 60 fps. the bleeds minimal.

I meant theres nothing in RE3R that is affected by FPS as much as knife damage was in RE2R.

 
  WanderingPastriesWanderingPastries

I mean, the knife wasn't the only thing that was affected by fps, in RE2r. Runs got faster at the dashboard, certain strats couldn't be done, there were noticeable dips in fps (to the point that mods had up a post about various spots in the game), and I'm almost certain that another weapon was affected by it.

I dunno about RE3, yet. Right now, I'm to busy trying to improve my play, to source differences, and get a run up. I was happier when the original post went up, about it being separate tho. If there is an actual mathematical reason against it, instead of conjecture, then cool. Guess that can be levied both ways tho.

NuZNuZ and RapixOnGamingRapixOnGaming like this. 
  kniferunkniferun

The strats in RE2R was due to knife damage. I thought.

I forgot about nemmy 3. Although that 30 FPS window was fishy.

 
  NuZNuZ

@SpeedIdolSpeedIdol thats a differens between 30/60/variable the ingame settings on PC. I have never seen that differens on console. All the consoles are 45-60fps. Some more stable than others. The time bleed is a second or less. Its fine with a filter for me but if the community whants different tabs for the lb position to show correct on profiles etc. Ofc they can change it. But remember, This game is most fair on console right now bec minimal differens between systems. On PC all systems bleed different. Its not only a fps thing the igt

 
  RE_SpeedrunsRE_Speedruns

Consoles should definitely be split on the boards, but its probably not a good time to do it. A few of these forum posts are ppl complaining about runs not getting verified quickly. The mods are probably backed up on submissions atm. They should be prioritizing that, which they probably are. I play on Xbox One X and a few parts of the game aren't loading properly. Any% NG+ Console record, which is from a normal ps4 seems to load these areas fine without pausing to allow the game to buffer, which is what i have to do. That same record has other areas of the game not load properly where my Xbox One X is loading them just fine. The game is running noticeably different on different consoles. I'd like to see a split in the boards but the mods probably dont have the time for it atm.

RapixOnGamingRapixOnGaming and tommy67phamtommy67pham like this. 
  tommy67phamtommy67pham

I believe people are underestimating the amount of runs that are being submitted. There are a ton of unverified runs and the mods also have other matters to attend to. Most of them stream and play the game as well folks.