Emulator Ban Request: Mesen (Run-ahead)
3 years ago

This is in line with other NES communities such as Ninja Gaiden. With the introduction of the new feature "run-ahead" that allows frames to be skipped in order to achieve "lower" latency, Mesen becomes a significant moderation nightmare and a frustration to non-English speakers who would be forced to switch from their favorite settings should they decide to perform attempts with run-ahead enabled, which is likely due to its benefits. (Run-ahead is capable of removing animation frames, thus alter original mechanics &, if my understanding is correct, deduct frames from the total sum of a given speedrun unrelated to human execution.)

Russia

@Tionic я согласен на эти изменения, после того как ты удалишь свои пробеги без требуемых инпут ввода и фреймкаунтера по основным правилам, которые тоже указаны в правилах NG (https://goo.gl/pYN6AR).

Я надеюсь на объективность модерации в этой игре, а не тупой ввод правил после запрета модераторов Mesen в SMB только лишь из-за наличия этой функции в последней версии, которая отключена по умолчанию.

PakLomak likes this
Russia

I disagree. It's not the emulator problem because this feature is turned off by default. It's the problem of a speedrunner. So to be honest if someone wants to be a cheater he will find the way. So I'm against of any restrictions because they will only make speedrunning more difficult for community. Banning the hole emulator because it will help to moderate the game is absurd. Who cares about speedrunners that are used to Messen, right? Let's ban everything and everyone will be happy (sarcasm) But it would be nice to mention in the rules that run-ahead feature is banned.

Edited by the author 3 years ago
JosephHTobinJr,
Deleted
and 3 others like this

Hi, ukionik! Glad to see you've stuck with this community over the years, as it is sadly rather neglected. (We don't even have a Discord channel!) While you're at it, please check out the other threads about the scrolling background that is a CPU devouring monster of a resource hog. Thanks!

In regards to Mesen and run-ahead (run ahead?), the issue may be that it is not viewed as cheating, but a handy tool to "lower" latency. (Doesn't actually lower it but uses hacks - if I should call it that - to cut out any desired number of frames from the equation.) Now I'm not certain if removing only the frames that don't factor into say the character's jumping animation would be entirely undetectable, but perhaps even that single frame would add up across the run to shave "many" frames from a speedrun such as SMB. So, we're in a rather problematic situation rules-wise because there almost aren't any rules for this silly game! At least none related to emulator technicalities. Which also brings us to the issue of keyboard players because let's not forget that we do have a top level keyboard player, and there's not even a shadow of a doubt how much advantage keyboard has over controller users when it comes to competing for WR, but I digress.

Mesen loyalty is simply pointless. It's an actively developed emulator, which means things could change to an unforeseeable degree. The reason why we like our retro speedruns is the rules are set is stone, and therefore no pesky devs patching out glitches and whatnot. :) As far as I'm concerned we should stick to the software that's been proven reliable and accurate enough (SMB community seems to be in favor of it), and that's Nestopia. But apparently Mesen has been hailed as the staple of accuracy and general superbness so much that people are willing to stake their lives in defense of its repute. Preposterous!

At the end of the day we're a rather inactive community with few submissions so it's easy to ignore the looming problems, but if I were you I'd consult the issue both internally amongst the mods and with other communities that had to deal with cheated runs such as the NG1 community and its mod team.

st4nzzz likes this
Sweden

sorry for the necro, but just to clarify that feature doesn't actually "shave frames" off anything, the run time at the end would be exactly the same length, and it also in no way alters any mechanics. :)

the potential advantage runahead could have is if you need to react on the fly to something very quickly, then it could possibly give you a frame or two of increased reaction time. the feature shouldn't be allowed, but i'm skeptical that it would be a good way to cheat in any game.