Yeah, I suspected that 240SX might be the best car, but you made a run before I even tried to test it :) Good job nonetheless. Is doing the challenge series actually necessary in Career any%?

240SX and RX-8 aren't the only good cars in Carbon. I've read that Elise is really awesome for handling as I think it's the lightest car in the game and Corvette is supposedly very good for canyon races and you can unlock it right at the beginning of Darius's territory.

Hmm, okay. What about Murcielago for stage 3?

Finally saw the run (I was at work yesterday) and I have noted couple things:

1. I think that you can unlock 240SX before doing any runs since it's a completely different mode even though it affects Career.

2. You mentioned that understeer actually means oversteer and vice versa? Is that some kind of a bug?

3. You said you don't like Corvette, yet I can clearly see you set your tires all the way to Drift. Was that just a mistake?

4. Why do you keep getting unique parts if you don't use them? Wouldn't be better to get Get out of jail free cards instead?

5. You seem to pick the fastest races, which is understandable, BUT I'm wondering if it could be faster to do certain races (even if they're slower) to unlock certain upgrade parts, that might make the run faster overall. It's definitely worth testing.

6. JessicaSix suggested using Cayman S for tier 2. Another thing to test, I guess :)

7. You really shouldn't read chat during races.

8. I've read that setting your engine to Torgue might be better than Horsepower, but I haven't tested it. It doesn't make sense for real cars, but maybe it does for NFS :D

9. Why did you set your brakes bias to rear on 240SX? Is that because of drifts?

10. You should be able to use keyboard in World map instead of mouse (Quick list). You have to remember which races you have to do though.

9. Yeah, thought so. Same thing works in NFSIII

Yes, you can unlock it before the actual run. Challenge series is a different mode. However, according to wikipedia, CE is not available for PS3 version, which automatically puts this version to disadvantage. All the other versions have it. Since there is already enough categories, I think we should create a variable "CE".

What glitch?

The question is if it works on all versions. Also, such glitch would be easily visible, so runs using it would get rejected.

We are not talking about NG+, we are talking about whether you can unlock that car before doing Career any% run. I don't understand why it should count since it's a completely different mode. That's like you would have to unlock El Nino in NFSIII in order to be able to use it for IL runs.

EDIT: If the Challenge Series would be an actual part of Career, then I would completely understand your opinion, JessicaSix.

On the other hand, I told you you're the "boss" of Carbon section, so the decision is up to you.

EDIT2: Btw, CE also includes Koenigsegg CCX. Might be worth checking.

I have no idea why you brought up 100% category. I'm just gonna quote from now on:

"So Game 100% category is stupid, because it is Career 100% and Challenge Series100%."

-Doesn't that guide you posted actually say you also need to unlock all cars and tracks?

"Career 100% and Challenge Series%, make no sense to me."

-Agreed.

"Callenge Series%, make no sense, because you must play all 3 levels of one series to unlock the next challenge."

-Agreed

"We do not have, Career any% and Challenge Series any% category. This is what Grim need."

-Honestly, I have no idea why would anyone want to run that. That's like what, 7 hours total? Yeah, right.

"El Nino in nfs 3 is IL. Do you want a IL category for Carbon ? This is boring man when you ask me, because you use the fastest car from the start on.

-Sure, IL should be here. Yes, El Nino in NFSIII is usable in IL mode only, but that doesn't change the fact you have to unlock it in Tournament mode before you can use it in IL mode (or Single race if you wish). This is the same thing. You play Challenge Series mode in order to unlock a car in Career mode. What's so boring about using the fastest car from the start? Isn't that a whole point of a speedrun?

"And IL need 100% unlock all in the game and than play the table."

-Yup, it's the same thing with unlocking stuff in one mode to get it in other mode.

"The 240sx is not the fastest car and also not for IL"

-Dude, you said so on the first page. ("This is boring man when you ask me, because you use the fastest car from the start on.")

Game% category? That's just bullshit. I still don't understand why we should punish players for having CE edition, only because CE offers a better starting car. I'm 100% sure we wouldn't have this discussion if CE wouldn't offer 240SX.

I've never liked Carbon before, but watching your runs sparked an interest in me to speedrun it since it's so easy and short, but if you're really gonna kill Career any% category, then I won't even bother to start.

By the way, I'm pretty sure someone's gonna make a run using unlocked 240SX that will be faster than any other run here, because he won't really care about some categories on speedrun.com

EDIT: There's a new WR by Trebr0n and he's not using 240SX.

''The Nissan 240SX only appears in the Collector's Edition release of Need for Speed: Carbon as a Tier 1 classed car. It is purchaseable for $20,000 and is unlocked upon completing every Checkpoint Race of the Collector's Edition Challenges.'' - http://nfs.wikia.com/wiki/Nissan_240SX_%28S13%29

For this reason i think this should either be a different category or not used at all, it's basically like a different version of the game. It's not in my 360 version either. If it was say, free on the store or something so everyone can get it then that's fine, but this isn't imo.

What's stopping you from buying it? It's available for x360. It's basically a DLC except you can't download it :)

EDIT: OK, here's an idea. How about we ban all unlockable cars in your first playthrough (or only allow them under condition of unlocking it during your run = what Grim did in his current run) and allow them in NG+? You could not only use 240SX, but also M3 GTR, Audi LM etc.

Hello, I'd like to run this game after I'm done with Most Wanted 2005. I followed a bit your discussion and I'd like to give my point of view.

Personnally I've got the standard edition on Xbox 360, and I don't plan to buy the game another time just for one car.

The last idea Ewil proposed is good. NG could be only drove with career cars, and then we make a NG+ game ( or NG DLC, dunno how you wanna call it), in which we can use any car you want.

Seven, are you routing MW or just doing it blindly? When i tried to run it awhile back it was kinda bad, failed the first boss because of rubber banding and just gave up. I'd help route it but i hate running long 6-8 hour+ games, especially with bullshit rng

Ewil, it would be easier for it to just undergo a different category

I agree There should be NG+ Because it's not fair to the guys who have Standard Edition so we can be on the same level.

Yeah definitely if it's sure that playing directly 240 SX is faster and impossible for standard edition to go faster than this, it should be a separate category.

Let's just keep these 2 categories and it'll be all fine I think. + challenge series% if needed.

@CyberThunder Yes, I am currently routing MostWanted. As it's Carbon topic here, I invite you to go to MW forum or check directly my routing which is WIP. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_Ok9A0WJd-ZM-II0JEcqjOwO9wZb2tOka5c8CapCMLs

Yeah, Trebr0n's run shows it doesn't pay off, so I agree with Grim there is no need for Standard - CE category.

Seven do you have an estimate time on an optimized MW run? It kinda feels like it could potentially be much shorter like 5 hours if it's fully routed

@CyberThunder No way. I don't have a precise estimated time right now as I only routed till #10 blacklist. My 1st goal is sub 10h, maybe sub 9 is possible, and maybe if my previsions are bad a sub 8 would be poss. But that wont go way under that.