Interesting behavior, when ESWing from another planet to ThornTail, the game will still play an Arwing cutscene:

Edit: More glitches. I'll keep updating this post.

ThornTail Under Attack event needs to be triggered properly, or completing it will do nothing:

If you ESW after getting K4, another ThornTail Under Attack event gets triggered. Completing it does nothing. Probably best to just turn in K4 and ignore it.

I think we're about to re-route this anyways due to the ESW discovery and WC2 soft-lock. Sorry for giving everyone a bad route, I should have tested it all the way to Andross.

Edit: Looks like Dark-X-Rane beat me to it. Here's some additional info:

When returning to ThornTail, if Fox spawns inside the ship, that means ThornTail is in a buggy state.

• Do not Save/Quit immediately when this happens, or you will return to Orbit. Wait until you hit a checkpoint.
• After getting SS1, the Beacon cutscene will play after 19s. It seems impossible to avoid the cutscene, even with Save/Quits. The best you can do with this time is to get 1x Flame Weed.
• Both LFV and MM Pass will not load properly. I don't think the LFV one is an issue for our current route. I haven't checked SnowHorn wastes, but that's not in route either.

I found one on Dinosaur Planet after turning in K3. Perhaps this will not cause issues:

Maybe this will improve time saves even more, since it can cut out unnecessary space flights, and save time running back from Volcano Point / Cape Claw / Ocean Point / SnowHorn Wastes / Walled City

A lot of travel can be replaced, assuming there are no bullshit soft-locks. I'll test to see if this can circumvent the WC2 soft-lock. It will take me a long time to test unfortunately.

Edit: The ESW saves running time, but still soft-locks if used for OP #2. We will need to use a Fire Gem / Disguise door strat to walk back manually.

Is DIM the only possible ESW location? Maybe we can ESW somewhere else to avoid the corrupted file.

I confirmed that walking back solves the problem. Perhaps ESW corrupts the save file? We can avoid the soft-lock, but it reduces the time save by 4-5 minutes due to an extra trip to Cape Claw.

I tried using a position hack to leave after placing SS4. This worked! Walled City 2 loaded correctly after running back from Ocean Point.

Somehow using ESW to leave Ocean Point causes problems.

Shit. Moon/Sun stones can't be placed. Any idea what went wrong?

Left: ESW, Right: Any%

It does not say "Placed Final SpellStone". Perhaps skipping Fire Gems is an issue? LFV? Should K3 be placed after placing SS2? So many things to test. Brutal.

EDIT: Oh, we skipped the cutscene with the Queen returning to Thorntail! Maybe we just need to activate this.

EDIT 2: Still not working, but talking to the Queen fixed the text:

It seems warping to Ice Mountain disables "Staff Energy Gem", "PukPuk Eggs", and "Dumbledang Pods" discovery.

I'm disappointed because this makes it harder to trigger item discovery for glitches.

Edit: Yep, looks like the K3 route soft-locks as BvqR discovered. See the K3 thread for details.

Jubjub seems indifferent: https://twitter.com/JubJubster62/status/1357851303976738817

I like the categories. My personal preference is that the main category changes, but it would be good to hear from the runners and get everyone's vote on this. My preference:

• Any% (Main category, rules that I posted above)
• Any% no R/ESW
• Any% with ESW setup file

Skyward Sword is very similar in this regard (https://www.speedrun.com/lozss/full_game). The main Any% route allows BIT and Reverse BIT, and they have a separate category for "Any% No BIT".

Edit: I have no preference on which categories are collapsed under Misc.

R/ESW was banned because it was basically New Game+. However, on an empty memory card, it does not make sense to ban it. Unbanning it would better capture the spirit of Any%.

This will not ruin the category. If my timing is correct, it could only reduce the WR by up to 8 minutes with current discoveries. Also, it will make glitch hunting this game fun again. So many more ideas and theories are possible now.

Edit: Due to the WC2 soft-lock, the save might be something comical like 1m, or it may even be worse. This discussion will need to be revisited when/if we make a breakthrough.

I'm proposing the following rules:

• No setup files allowed. All runs must start with all 3 save slots empty.
• No use of built in cheat codes.
• No use of Turbo controllers or controller mods.

K4 early is possible with a Turbo controller. If runners prefer this route, we could discuss this as a category split, but most communities ban these since it is technically "tool assisted" and prohibitive to new runners.

Yeah I've tested that one, flight progression triggers work as such:

• Must have flown to the previous zone
• The first flight MUST start from Dinosaur Planet (For example, unlocking CRF and doing an ESW to DIM means you have to fly to Dinosaur Planet and then CRF)
• Later flights can start from anywhere. The K3 early ESW route flies from DIM to Walled City #2 after an ESW.

Edit: Looks like I was wrong, and it wasn't Walled City #2.

I have done Walled City #2 after K3 early (but have not tried K4 early). On that file I did Walled City #1. It might be what Dark-X-Rane said -- maybe we need to either:

• Have flown to Walled City #1
• Have obtained SS3

I forgot to post the video for this

Not useful here, but maybe somewhere else it can be used

Edit: I tried to use this in Cape Claw without Tricky. Kill enemy on ramp, and pick up Mana crystal. Unfortunately, a recovery is not possible. Fox will stay voided out.

Oh yeah, I forgot we need Flame to death warp.

SS1 skip actually ends up with soft-lock in 3 places:

• The 1st SpellStone gate won't open with SS3 unless opened with SS1 before
• The 2nd SpellStone gate won't open unless the torch color puzzle was solved before obtaining SS3 (puzzle will be inactive later).
• The kill door after the 2nd gate will just be a solid invisible wall unless solved earlier before getting SS3.

Right now it let's us skip buying Firefly Lantern, GrubTub Well, SnowHorn Trials, and obtaining SS3. That's why I also want to find Freeze Blast skip.

With Freeze Blast skip we can finally skip Volcano Point, MM Pass Key, Blow Horn, and SS1.

EDIT: I guess if we never get SS3, the puzzles should still be doable later. BvqR's strategy of returning to DIM later will work then.

One possible route (I left out Bafomdad pickups / bag):

• <Start route as normal>
• Buy 5x Fuel Cells
• DIME
• Create RESW file at DIM
• Get Flame
• Fly back to ThornTail
• K4 early with underwater walking (Doing it now is a good idea so that we can pick up Fuel Cells)
• ESW to DIM
• Fly back to ThornTail
• Get Rocket Boost, Mana Upgrade <Do K3 early. After ESW, finish DIM> <Continue Route as normal, skipping SnowHorn Trials and SS3>

Also it may be possible to finish DIM after placing SS4. I'll test the route for soft-locks and see if K4 before K3 works.

Entering GrubTub Well disables the Fuel Cell cutscene? Weird. I'll have to test this out later.

What about obtaining Rocket Boost? We need it 3 times in Dark Ice Mines, so we can't postpone obtaining it I think.

TAS route might have to be: Get Tricky > Get Bofomdad in SnowHorn Wastes > Buy Bafomdad bag > Get Bofomdad outside Thorntail Shop > Warp back to Ice Mountain > Cannon Clip > K4 with underwater walking > Get Rocket Boost > DIME

Not sure if it's faster, but at least it's possible. Also I'm not sure if Cannon clip is required, is it possible to get OOB with the same strategy as DIME? 🤔

Edit: We need 1 more Bofomdad, since Fox takes damage getting OOB. Edit 2: My route is bad, since Tricky needs Flame for us to death ESW warp. See the rest of this thread for details.

It's worth thinking about ways to bypass that (and the K5 shrine flames). It may not be possible, but if a RTA viable K4 early was discovered, I think Freeze Blast becomes the next bottleneck.

Edit: Alternatively, a way to bypass the first 2 doors in Volcano pass would be sufficient. Picking up Freeze Blast isn't so much the issue, getting SS1 is.

Yikes, just tried it out. Spamming the A button I was able to get in like 4 swings before I failed. Maintaining this for 2.5 minutes would be brutal.

So it's TAS viable (May still be slower unless we also figure out Freeze Blast skip). Unless Turbo controllers aren't banned lmao, but it would be cruel to make speedrunners buy that.

Impressive! I've never seen this underwater walking glitch before.

So that means K4 early is possible if we buy all Fuel Cells from the ThornTail Store, and use multiple Bafomdads?

Edit: Did some quick math on this: Hypothermia deals 1/4 heart damage every 5 seconds (1 heart per 20 seconds) = 7.5 hearts required for this trick, 8+ to be safe. That plus any hearts required to get OOB in the first place.