Esperanto
Supporter" Is there any possible way I can change the order of the games for that to appear on the bottom?"
There isn't, but it would be neat if there was a way to organize your pages other than by date submitted (such as ABC order or, in this case, ranking on a given lb).
Until then, you got to improve your G'n'G runs and then never run anything again so you have no more recent runs. :(
Hmm, very small thing, but I've noticed that if you have a Misc subcategory underneath a normal category, then the runs aren't classified as "Misc runs." Is it possible to make it so both Misc categories and Misc subcategories both mark a run as Misc run?
I'm not really sure how much effort it would take to make that possible, but, yes it would be convenient.
"And for that reason I've talked about a third request type, called Compilations, as the games included in that collections can be different respect the original one, and in order to have a standard way to define compilation leaderboards.
It can be difficult to implement (I have no idea) but it's something that could help to solve this "problem" we're talking about (as how are they shown, as different categories or as a Individual Levels) and also to fix the already existent compilation leaderboards, like this one: https://www.speedrun.com/Midway_Arcade_Treasures"
Yeah, I think that method would be exceedingly difficult, but what I could imagine would work is having a Compilation option in the same field as "ROM Hack"/"Fangame" etc. That would allow a game page for compilation to have some sort of reference to the games in contains (Assuming those games have been added somewhere on the board).
So on a "Activison Anthology" it would have "Compilation" and then possibly a list of those individual game pages that exist on the compilation, given that those pages exist. However, if you were on the Dragster page, it wouldn't necessarily show you that Dragster was part of the Activision Anthology. Not particularly perfect, but I imagine much easier to add to database.
Basically, you submit your individual runs as "separate runs" whenever you have done them.
Say you got a time of 5 minutes today. You submit and it gets accepted. That run will now show up.
The next day, you get a run of 4 minutes. You do not need to edit or alter your previous run. Just go to the same Submit Run button, fill out the info with your new time, and the database will automatically hide your old run on the leaderboard (but will keep track of it for purposes of counting how many runs you have submitted to the site. It's particularly nice when past WR's don't get edited ever, because if they do, they will disappear from a game's statistic page).
Pretty much processor from the Pentium III up (anything at or above1.0 ghz) is going to allow you emulate as quickly as necessary pretty much anything you'd be doing, especially in terms of games. So pretty much anything from like the last 20 years that isn't complete trash.
Outside that, DOSBox emulates everything through the CPU, and it interprets its own speed based on the CPU's speed. There is no perfect match up that I know of. It's all adjusting the emulated processor's speed to match the speed of game play of others. This results in slight differences in emulated speeds among different CPU's.
For the purposes of speedrunning, this usually results in two cases.
1.) The nicer thing is if the software/game being operated in anyway has an internal timer set into the game. This sets essentially a top speed the game can be played, when the IGT timer and actual graphics of the game are dependent on one another. Lemmings, is a great example. There are aspects about the game that can faster, such as a opening screen animation, and the fade in/out times between load screens (these top out as well, but at a much higher rate than necessary for the game to run at the top speed the IGT allows it.
2.) Some games.... yea, don't have that. See Jazz Jackrabbit. The only way this really be accounted for if when people agree to a given number of cycles for game play (usually the default of 3000 cycles). Unfortunately, there can still be tiny differences in actual speed of game play on different computers, though generally the name of the game is to find something that for all intents and purposes, is close enough. The frame rate of these games is based on the instruction speed of the given CPU (or emulated CPU in this case). Back in the day, when these games were made for DOS and such, they just relied on the native speed of the user's CPU. It didn't result in ridiculously fast game play because you wouldn't get a faster CPU for a few years at a time.
Also for the purposes of speedrunning, it's pretty general rule of thumb that you should run DOSBox on your computer, opposed through a web browser.
I have a slew of NES games, as well as GB, GBC, GBA games on my profile, that are usually shorter runs and such. You might be able to find something that strikes your interest in there.
Sorry, got a little too drunk last night to reply.
"I wanted to know, from the reason of the rejection, and from Liv's reply, which is the criteria they follow to know if the game can be acceptable to request a leaderboard or not.
If, after that, the conversation has led to where it belongs a game who is inside a compilation, is not because I had a temper tantrum or something like that. I'm not angry about the rejection, as I said before, I respect the mod's decision."
Aw, you're good. I'm just, cautious about phrasing because sometimes people act, strangely. Also, I'm pretty sure I come off as a douche 90% of the time.
"And also maybe (I don't know how difficult can it be) create a request type so you can organise better the games inside that compilation and more standardized : http://prntscr.com/kd4lld"
That would be neat, but I would imagine would be incredibly difficult to implement.
"-The Best Of Entertainment Pack: All the games included inside this compilation were released before. I've never played one of those games inside the compilation, so I have no idea if there is a difference between that game and the "original" previously released.
But, in the case that someone wants to request a leaderboard only for TicTacTics, would be accepted? Separately or together with the times of the compilation game?"
I agree it's not the greatest example. There is only one true compilation of basically emulated games on the site, so it's not really an issue that's routinely come up or something.
Very specific and super complicated, since TicTacTics was originally part of Microsoft Entertainment Pack 1 (which, for most people, came native with Win3.1) The thing is though, some of these games have indeed continued on. SkiFree's designer has it working for modern computers in the form of 4.2. TicTacTics also exists as a mobile game now. JezzBall was updated and released as JezzBall Galaxy for Windows 8. I think if you were playing the versions 1.0 of the game, which would likely be done through an emulator (Win3.1 can be emulated through DosBox), that the compilation might be more appropriate, whereas the games that have been altered, updated and independently sort of released at a later time might be better as page.
The GBC "Best of Microsoft Entertainment" Pack is a mix of games from different packs and ported. And naturally a Game Boy port of individual games recombined as such, plays differently, and makes since as a separate pack.
Granted though, really early computer games can get complicated in this regard because their lives are not necessarily in the traditional way games are generally released. If it was up to me, I'd have Microsoft Entertain Pack 1, 2, etc. as a thing for anyone running the original software, and then individual pages in instances where some of those games were revamped or re-released, etc.
"-Action 52: Aside from, IMO, horrible presentation (with a lot of categories instead of separate them as Individual Levels, like happens on The Best Of Entertainment), the games inside were "original" and never released before, so I have no complains about include all games into in a leaderboard with the compilation's name."
Fair point.
"That's the biggest problem, but that is what I'm trying to ask and talk with all of you, to see how to deal with the compilations."
Tbh, the way different content moderators judge whether a game will be accepted is entirely subjective, as far as determining whether is something notable. I would imagine since Boxing was rejected (which is a shame), that Activision Anthology also likely would (though, only one way to really that one out). In my mind, both would be good to go, but, alas, I am but a lowly runner of games, offering only my thoughts on the matter.
Best way, I might imagine, getting advice from a mod about, whether you should submit a compilation or as separate pages, would be asking a mod in the discord for advice. Just because they all slightly differ in how they work and were made, would probably be hard to lay down a consistent ruling for it, that and because it's such a rare issue as far as game submissions go, it's probably not high priority.
As far as getting the information on the game request page updated to more accurately reflect what it is specifically they do or do not accept (with some sort of disclaimer that games may be rejected for more or less any reason a mod might come up with), I'd love to see, but that's a topic that... comes up routinely.
But yea, I tend to overthink the data because I'm constantly with databases at work, and just tend to see possible issues arising on the long term. And yea, I appreciate the chat by the way; the topic of game data and so fourth is interesting to me. I think it terms of possibly requesting something like, just go with what you think might be best. It's not like there's a permanency to things that can't be later fixed or addressed should issues arise.
"And it won't be more confusing if for the same game there are two different leaderboards? And one of them with another completely different name.
The anthology where is located that game is called Activision Anthology, one of the games included is Dragster, and following the criteria as you proposed, there would be two leaderboards:
-The first one called Dragster. -The second one called Activision Anthology, and inside their leaderboard, one of its categories will be called Dragster.
It looks confusing and completely illogical imo, because nobody will look (or would be less common) for Dragster inside the Anthology."
I mean, conversation is sort of moot given that the game wasn't accepted. But, for the sake of conversation, I'm pretty sure if you tried to submit a Dragster run using the Activision Anthology for PS2, it would be rejected. So, for people trying to Dragster runs in the Anthology would have no where to submit times.
Personally, if I'm playing some other compilation game, the first thing I would do is look for the name of the compilation. The most important title is the one on the package of the game you are putting into a system and playing it. At least, IMO.
Example: https://www.speedrun.com/the_best_of_entertainment_pack https://www.speedrun.com/action_52
"There are already multiplatforming games that are in the same leaderboard but in different categorys. The same game with different strats and different loading times. Why do you want to make an exception with this kind of games?"
There are also multiplatforming games that have their own page very every specific release of the game (See: Tetris) Those sorts of things come down to the game and community, because sometimes games be incredibly consistent among platforms, and other times same titles can be very different. There is no right/wrong way to do it; but it's not really an "exception" considering many titles are listed in both ways.
"Also, in the case of Activision Anthology there are more than 50 games, would you like to see 50 categories? That would be a complete mess."
Could easily be addressed by making individual games on the level board, which allows per level subcats to be made. "Action 52" would look better, IMO, if it was like that, but it's not really a necessity by any means, and I rank aesthetics second to accuracy myself.
But moot point, at least for now. "Anthology" games are a specific issue that is a bit different than just a "multiplatformer." I think it works either way, but without any sort of site-wide consistency on the matter, I'd expect a clusterfuck to occur either direction. The site is excellent for individuals to set up individual boards and set them up how they deem reasonable. It's not always so great on addressing an issue that would involve multiple boards and mods.
Right, but there is like 80 games in that anthology. Just because your board would cover both versions doesn't mean every Atari game board is also going to accept both versions. Likely end up with a situation where some Atari games could be played on this specific PS2 anthology, while others wouldn't be accepted. There's also more than one Atari compilation.
That being said I looked up Centipede as an example, because it's on both the Atari Collection 1 and the Atari Collection 2 for PS. They put all consoles of the game on one board. They going to make a "PS - Atari Collection 1" and "PS - Atari Collection 2"? I guess so. At least it's actually subcatted out.
So either way, the issue of Atari ports inside compilations I'm sure will remain incredibly unorganized indefinitely since that type of organization is larger than a single game and doesn't quite fall into a "series."
If the game was released as part of a PS2 Compilation, it would make far more sense to request the actual compilation itself as the game (Atari Anthology (PS2)). It would be insane to add the run as if it had been played on the Atari game called "Boxing" assuming they ran they same.
That being said, always disappointing to see an officially licensed game Atari, C64, MS-DOS, or GBA game get rejected.
Hmm, it's a peculiar situation. I can think of a couple different solutions you could try. The main being getting some sort of capture device for the 3DS (or whatever specific device your using). They can be a bit pricey since it's such a unique object, but it is available. Another might be switching over to a 3DS emulator and playing on a computer. I don't know if this is a workable solution for you or not though. I see on Brain Age 1, for example, that pictures are accepted up to a certain time limit before videos are required. Maybe submit your game and your photos and explain your situation (so long as your capable of verifying other people's submitted runs). Ideally though, recording anything is ideal, and given that a camera is not much of an option for you (unless something like a GoPro might be effective), a capture device of some sort, or using emulation might be the solution to getting videos down.
So the alternative path you get sometimes from maximum spring position can also be used to launch the ball in the right loop. On the alternative path, it looks similar, but the ball will end up moving along the right paddle. You can't get the ball in the right loop with the right paddle with this intro, but the ball will roll down the paddle and bounce on the left one. One of the positions the ball bounces onto the left paddle will allow you to launch in the right loop. Should save a few a resets if you can get that one too.
It's my opinion the 10910 intro or the 9600 probably both have some scenario where you could also put in the right loop quickly, but likely have to TAS it out to make a route with it and wouldn't be easy and consistent as the one described above. But yea, it's a grind now, just trying not to mess up the run once you finally get the bonus activated (did it twice last night). Such is life.
So, I've been back to grinding this game for the last couple of days and just wanted to share a couple of observations.
First, the 10810 (which should actually be called the 10910) is not the fastest possible intro. If the spring is released a couple of compression animations sooner, there is a 9600 intro. It gets the ball to your left paddle in 19 seconds, as opposed to 22, and one of the possible shots you can take from is one that can be shot onto the bumper for a couple bounces. It nets 22xxx points is roughly the same time. Granted far more difficult.
But tbh, I think even this strategy will no longer work. Put simply, the slot machine bonus on the top page is key. A couple days ago, I got half a second behind my record. 500 attempts later though, and I'm not getting close again. On Game B, the 3 minute record is a perfect example of why it's going to be necessary to essentially get the God run.
So there is some good news. If the ball is released at the spring's maximum point, the ball bounces in such a way that it will land on the left bumper (not 100%. there is an alternative bounce it does. I suspect this has to do with alternating possibilities dictated by odd and even frames). There is a frame available with the left paddle that gives you a clean shot to the right loop. You hit and the roulette starts.
The roulette has three possibilities. All 3's, all 7's or all penguins. The 3's and 7's stand for seconds the bonus will last. The screen turns red instead of blue, and the middle safety bumper appears. This will last 3 or 7 seconds long. The penguins though, enable the bonus indefinitely AND, the most important part, it doubles all the points you get while it is active. The only two things that will deactivate the bonus is if you drop below via the left channel, or if you spin the roulette wheel again by getting the right-side loop.
So the new real strategy is this. Shoot at maximum spring location, use left paddle to get the roulette going. Get 3 penguins as fast as you can. Then proceed to get points, ideally through some great combination of the three ways to do so. (Heck if anyone can replicate the GOD BOUNCE my WR does now, with the bonus, would net 60k+ points).
The what sucks though, is that, given there isnt some other factor, the roulette wheel has a 1/27 chance of being all three penguins. You got less than a 4% chance of getting all the penguins, and very easy to mess up after the fact still.
Additionally, Game B is no different in this regard. Game B contains all the same patterns, just every thing is sped up, which makes the first shot you need to do a little bit tighter.
In any case, I'm going to try for it for a bit. If anyone can get it, they should definitely be able to get a WR that would incredibly difficult to overcome.
.io games are generally small pvp games where players have no control of the room they are in or the players they are playing with. That'd be my guess. They aren't really subject to manipulation by having given players in a room, etc., and individual players have no way to customize or alter their character.
I'm unable to find any great information or testing for this specific emulator. In general, mGBA is the regarded as closest to most accurate. I know it has an macOS release, but do not know if that works for an iPad? If so I'd recommend that. Otherwise, not necessarily against it, but it may be rejected or removed in the future if that emulator is determined to be inaccurate in the future.
More important: So, since we can't add the Japanese names of games anymore, since some were incapable of using the correct character set, would it be possible to get an additional request forum for the adding of Japanese names of games. I have a handful currently that are missing any sort of Japanese translation, so I'd imagine someone looking for Japanese version of the game could be problematic in the future.
Less important: Would there be a way to get a European title field as well? Obviously, not nearly as relevant, but one an the occasional examples, titles can be pretty different. I don't know if this would work at all because the language field in question seems to attached to actual languages table, and not locations table.
When discussing it with some others, there was also an issue for really specific examples of where a game might have a different name in one specific language (because of a specific translation not working out great). Not sure if this is at all a great or bad idea; but could the field be described as "alternative title" or something like that, where one could add the location-specific title, and then select from a range of possibilities, the location that is relevant (Japan, EU, Brazil, Korea, Germany) etc.?
Given that the game is not in need of a moderator, and that's a pretty decent reason in and of itself, I'm going to venture to say short of the current moderator making you a moderator upon your request to them specifically, that your chances of actually becoming a mod for that are incredibly low.
Full Moderators do not assign to new game moderators to a game just cause it was requested. They do assign new mods to games where mods go inactive. You can request that there: https://www.speedrun.com/The_Site/thread/63nr7 but I'd probably read the first post first. Also, probably not going to happen unless you have a pending run for the game.
