See image below but I can upload the spreadsheet easily, just ask!
Each run has 2 lines, the one on the top is the time in the video and the one at the bottom is just a calculation of the time of the video minus the start, so you have RT at the bottom. The lines with dates and time are just my runs to compare the difference between RT and GT.
I start counting when a button has been clicked like Make Paperclip or Lower or Raise and stops when reached 100% like it's been discussed in another thread. Some small mistakes by the moderators, here's the most important ones:
marcf999 : RT should be 1h43m56s (I've asked it 17d ago but still no reply in another thread)
strawdonkey : RT should be 2h23m11s
jeli : RT should be 1h57m22s
vivafringe : RT should be 2h04m43s
waltyuen : RT should be 2:08:03
BaguetteSensei : RT should be 2:20:03
JJ : IGT should be 2:26:26 and RT 2:27:59
And then some other mistakes and some of my comments :
Elipsis
This run is clearly Patch 0 and not Patch 2 because in his run he had to go to 50 Solar Farms and not 30 to get Momentum Project. It's just like vivafringe which is already Patch 0.
Geoper
Notice the mouse movement just after 00:54, that is clearly AHK / TAS. Script went wrong and he started back with the ENTER key at 1:12. Personally, I would ask Geoper to make another run because who knows what the script does in the whole run. It's a good run in position 9 but it's an easy to reproduce run. I actually don't think he actually cheated, might have been a script for something else but it's clearly established that you cannot use a script in this game.
GermanSpaceAce
When he reach 100% in Space Exploration, the console message of IGT appears exactly 11s later. It's unique, never seen that before. He reached 100k and the console message showed by the same second, which it was it should be. And it's weird because his last Strategic Modeling before he ends, the message shows at the same time after Round 64. His computer is probably lagging. Not important I would say but worth mentioning.
Christopho, jeli, Veloso, SteveTheBartender, homeknop, RiaCorvidiva, planetcarter
Those are uniques, they all have an IGT higher than RT. This, I don't think it's supposed to happen. Something is going on here. You get a low IGT by interacting in the game but Kragnir TAS run still have an IGT lower than RT by 3s and his script is clicking non-stop the whole run faster than a human can do. I haven't been able to reproduce this. Would be interested in knowing what other people think, maybe I'm missing something?
Kragnir TAS run : youtube.com/watch?v=xQLRGZ3BIsY
RatHound, AprilSR, MissDesGames
Videos unavailable. Cannot see them. That is a gray zone on this website. At one point the moderators approved them. But for the rest of us, we did not and we haven't seem them. Considering I've already found quite a few mistakes, the chance of having a mistake on those runs are not small. Moderators should try to reach them and ask them to put the videos back or make another run. At the end of the day, they all did over 2h both RT and IGT so those runs are not record breaking. RatHound was 7y ago, it's a possibility he was on Patch 0.
More discussion here: https://www.speedrun.com/forums/the_site/uor1k#q78iz
Esth
I will finish with this run. It's probably a hack in my opinion. Profile has only one other run from 7y ago in position #8 for World of Warcraft Legion: Archive(2016) from Twitch and content unavailable. His second speedrun record is this game with the youtube video available but Comments turned off. His youtube video was created May 19, 2022 and has only one video. And guess what, his record was added 2022-05-20, just one day later. He made a youtube account for the sole purpose of this. This is so suspect. His speedrun profile is empty. So he is not well know, no notoriety. No audio in the video and we don't see him/her playing. This is a web browser game so easy to cheat. His Investments is really lucky, it is actually possible to do but the chances would be very high. If he had more notoriety, I wouldn't say anything but this is not the case.
His time and the money:
- 35:48 42m
- 35:50 55m
- 35:52 66m
- 35:55 75m
- 36:02 88m
- 37:07 96m
- 36:10 112m
- 36:12 135m
- 36:17 140m
- 36:27 150m
- 36:30 160m
Clearly not as fast as this one here : youtube.com/watch?v=eBxsnP9JNmk
But this one's using TAS and Luck Manipulation at the maximum (cheat). Still, I find some similarity at 40m by getting around 10m every tick.
I bet if you flag the video has Hack, he will never say anything by trying to prove it is legit.
Spreadsheet
Well, it's been 8 months. Few corrections :
marcf999 : RT has already been corrected from 1h43m56s to 1h43m56s around 4 months ago in another thread
strawdonkey : RT modified from 2h24m20s to 2h23m11s
jeli : RT modified from 1h58m11s to 1h57m22s
vivafringe : RT modified from 2h4m56s to 2h4m43s
waltyuen : RT modified from 2h9m23s to 2h8m3s
BaguetteSensei : RT modified from 2h19m51s to 2h20m3s
JJ : IGT modified from 2h23m0s to 2h26m26s and RT from 2h26m26s to 2h27m59s
Elipsis : needed 30k Creativity and not 20k Creativity for Momentum, so clearly another way to know he is not Patch 2 but Patch 0 so he he been updated to Patch 0
Since both Elipsis and vivafringe are Patch 0 and that there is nobody Patch 1 and everyone else is Patch 2. I don't think it makes sense to keep Patch 0. Less than a year and it will be gone, unless someone tell me a good reason to. It's just 2 records and nothing special so nothing is lost really.
Geoper : I've asked him on his youtube account what happened with his mouse going all over like an AHK script 9 months ago and still no answer. Must be said, his youtube has one video 1 month ago so he is still active but he has only a single speedrun here. It's not even a record or anything but it's not legit. He has been marked as Pending and not Rejected for now. Will be rejected in less than a year.
GermanSpaceAce : his video is weird but still seem 100% legit and not because of the useless website at the end which can be easily faked, not much to be said, his record his far from anything interesting, let's keep it for now
Christopho, jeli, Veloso, SteveTheBartender, homeknop, RiaCorvidiva, planetcarter : They do seems legit but whatever I tried, it's impossible to get an IGT higher than RT. Does not make sense even with a really slow computer. I will ask them the question and we will see what's next. Maybe they are running Patch 0 or even Patch 1?
RatHound, AprilSR, MissDesGames : Those videos unavailable are such a gray zone. Been approved by a mod before but there is so much errors everywhere. They are all pending now and going deleted in less than a year unless those streamers say Hi. Not that it really matters, RatHound has RT 2h9m38s, AprilSR has 2h10m50s and MissDesGames has 2h19m54s.
Esth : still no new speedruns nor youtube videos, still has a single one, has been marked as Pending, will be deleted in less than a Year
MissDesGames has responded by saying I can delete the video since it's unavailable, might do another record in the future so it's been deleted.
Hi there ! I haven't played this game for 5 years, I am only finding this discussion now.
As I explained to Zurd in PM, I am not sure what can cause IGT to be higher than RT, but it was definitely happening, at least back when I was playing. All my runs had a few seconds of difference between IGT and RT, possibly both ways. I never got a huge difference.
I was playing on a pretty fast MacBook Pro laptop with Chrome (no significant lag, I think), with my keyboard delay set to make the Enter key produce exactly 30 inputs per second. It was the only OS+browser combination that I found at that time to end up with precisely 30 inputs per second. I was playing the latest version at that time (March 2021).
The IGT was always inaccurate in all my runs, for sure, and not always in the same way: sometimes too low and sometimes slightly too high. It just felt random. Ending up with a high IGT like in my PB was disappointing since at that time, IGT was the deciding time.
My guess is that one of the conditions for it to happen is (or was) to have low lag. Probably not the only condition but maybe knowing this can help? The next step should probably to check the source code for things like potential rounding errors, but I don't even know if the source code was the same 5 years ago, or if it still behaves the same today with newer browser versions. Anyway, I also feel that IGT should be completely ignored in this game.
I'd be happy to help if you need more information about my runs. I hope that whatever I can still remember from 5 years ago can still be useful.
IGT start when you open the page, since you wait 5 seconds before doing anything you get 5 extra seconds of IGT compared to RT.
I think Christopho explains it well when he modified the keyboard input delay, I don't see what anything else can be made to achieve an RT less than IGT. Maybe others who has the weird timing did something similar, either modifying the keyboard input or the mouse input.
Complete list of weird timing where RT is less than IGT:
Christopho - 4s - 5y ago
SteveTheBartender - 5s - 5y ago
Veloso - 3m31s - 5y ago
RiaCorvidiva - 0s - 5y ago
jeli - 3s - 4y ago
homeknopf - 3s - 2y ago
With that being said, let's keep those records even if the timing is weird. Still feel legit.
Note that I added a new guide : Game Changelog, if you think something else can be added in it, let me know.
Also won't removed IGT time, let's keep it to prove that IGT is just a bad way to calculate the time since Firefox is really bad at it.
I'm not sure about keeping records of Patch 0 in the Leaderboards, only 2 people have it from 8 years ago which is Elipsis and vivafringe, nowhere near a record and there was a few issue with this version where you can cheat. Anyone's else opinion in this is appreciated. See the Game Changelog, Patch 0 and Patch 1 was only available for a few days, everything else is Patch 2. I also checked people' record with 7 years ago record and they are running Patch 2.
So you guys made me want to play the game again! I just had a 1:34:18 RTA / 1:34:19 IGT so new WR after validation 😄 It is so fun to grind it again. A 4 minutes PB!
I would be happy to discuss strats of all 3 phases, perhaps in another thread. Anyway, thank you all for keeping the game active!
You just got the new World Record, congrats !
We haven't asked you for anything haha, I've been grinding for 2 weeks again and still nowhere this :D
So you're saying RT 1:34:18 and IGT 1:34:19 so IGT is higher than RT
However, I calculated RT 1:34:22 and IGT 1:34:19, so IGT lower than RT
RT is always supposed to be higher than IGT
You started clicking on the first button "lower" at 00:00:03 and finished at 01:34:25 so clearly it's 1:34:22 RT.
Which now, I understand the small differences in seconds in many runs. When you start clicking on "lower" button or any other buttons, then the Real Timer starts but after that you go and click on your own timer so you lose time. A few seconds granted but it accounts for those mysterious seconds I am wondering about for a long time.
I've seen what you did in Stage 3 (Drifters versus Total), going to go and try it but yes, another thread, let's keep this thread on the same subject please :)
Ah I see, the rules until yesterday told that the timer starts when clicking "Make paperclips" the first time, so I was used to set the price to 0.04 before that.
Yah it was in the rules before but it was always assumed that it's the first interaction, I just made it more clear.
But even after you clicked Make Paperclips, you then go start the timer, so there's still a one second difference :)
Hey! So glad to see Christopho back! I can't wait to see what you did. Using the prior methodology, I was able to achieve 1:36:07. Now I have incentive to go even better. I didn't post my 1:36:07 run because I wanted to do even better!
A question for you, Zurd. Why in the rules does it state that people should contact the mod if they want to use a faster keyboard rate? Are you actively considering this?
That was added by the last moderator and I removed it. He probably offered it to make a new category for this type of gaming. I could make one but aside from Stage 1, you won't need it after so I don't think it would be interesting.
Just now happened to see that my run has been removed from the leaderboards.
My run is not cheated although of course I can't prove it. Just answers to the points raised here:
I am not an active speedrunner but I am known in the classic WoW speedrunning community, at least prior to classic launch (for example in this forum: https://barrens.chat/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=904&start=625 my name is est)
Yes, I did make a youtube account for the sole purpose of this speedrun, I didn't know my credentials to my other throw-away youtube-account.
My investment is really lucky because I had a ton of reruns just to get past investments with a good time since that is the one big rng factor in this game.
Although it's wrong in this case, it's nice to see such thorough investigations. Maybe I'll find the time to get a better run again.
Impossible to prove you are Est on the other forum. Even if the nickname was Esth with an h. Still old forum post of 7 years ago.
I still have to check the best runs and check the investment. Yours still appears to be way too lucky. Like it's been said before, this game is easy to cheat. If possible, make a new run. Your run is still in Pending state. Hasn't been deleted.
As for AprilSR, this user replied about the missing twitch video, this speedrun record will not be deleted, we can't verify the time but it's 2h10m50s so nothing special about it, can be easily beaten.
My Youtube channel where I uploaded the Paperclips speedrun is also called Est: https://www.youtube.com/@est7832 which is very similar to my other channel which also had the sole purpose of uploading some WoW speedruns: https://www.youtube.com/@est9903 (not that being a known great and liked player makes you immune to cheating, there are a lot of examples)
I also was surprised how lucky I was with the investments, I even had to wait 2-3 mins after I already had enough $ to also get 121M clips which never happened before (usually other way around).
Geoper run has been rejected. Like I said, clearly a script at 00:52. Not that it's a record breaking run but since we clearly see he's using a script, maybe the script does something else too. Worst part is that the script actually made his run worse. So he can always do a better one in the future. He had 02:00:50. Available here : youtube.com/watch?v=LHSYe0bndwA
I modified a bit the Rules of the game, stating no script like AHK. Even though I wouldn't mind a script that makes 30 Clips Per Seconds, the thing is that we cannot tell what it does. Maybe it does 31 Clicks Per Seconds or something else.
New category with Patch 0 in the Leaderboards. Let's just keep them for history.
I'm still working on the new spreadsheet of Investments. Esth run is pretty solid and lucky in Investments but not as much as someone else. I've marked his run as Verified and he is back with the WR, congrats! I will share the spreadsheet in another thread, this one is getting too long, I just want to close it and move forward. Coming kind of soon, probably 2 weeks.
