Are they still banned?

They've come a long way now - other games have them (albeit with specific restrictions to remain fair).

I think this should be discussed, maybe. Thanks! <3

I would love to run AE3 on emulator, I've been wanting to run it but saw just the other day that emulator is banned, I know some games use timegating where an emulator run can only be so good before it gets its time capped, perhaps that is worth considering?

Regardless I'll probably wrangle up a console to run it eventually but I'd love to have the Emu option in the meantime

i dont know if the game has enough activity where allowing emulator with a time restriction makes much sense and its not like the game isnt accessible, you can get a ps2 pretty cheap (like 20€), mod it easily and play on a burned dvd.

if you have a ps3 (any model), modding it is super easy and nowadays required to get the psn (most optimal) version. ps3s can be found kinda cheap too.

nothing is stopping you from learning the game and running on emulator to see if you want to get more serious about it and get a ps2/3. you just wont be listed on the boards.

Legalizing emulators allows people with financial limitations to participate in running the game, simply by separating it into "Disc" and "Emulator/USB".

you do know that the most optimal version is PSN, right? you cant just split this game into "disc" and "emulator/usb".

"usb" doesnt even make any sense as a split when you can just burn a disc and itll play identical to an original disc, both require a modded system anyway. modding a ps3 to get the best version is super easy.

again, you can parcitipate in running the game on emulator. you just wont be ranked on the leaderboards. an emulator tab would probably only get like two runs anyways and then go dormant, this isnt a popular game.

the boards could in theory allow emulator and hide them by default, but that would just give more work for the mods.

It looks like the last time someone posted a run was 3 weeks ago, and 3 months ago before that. I don't think it's really all that much work to set up a tab that just says "Emulator" though i could be wrong. Surely getting more runners in the community is a good thing and not just more work no?

You do know what financial limitations mean, right? In America, PSN ranges from $18 before tax per month to $160 before tax per year. That doesn't even include the cost of purchasing a PS4 or PS5. That's to run one single game the "optimal" way. And then you're talking about purchasing and modding a PS3 as if everyone has the money, time, or ability to do that either.

Also, you absolutely can just split this game into "disc" and "emulator/USB". It would be under the console. While the USB would act similarly to a burned disc. Klonoa (2008) made this distinction on their runner page. It's a single tab. Allowing more people to participate is in no way a bad thing and does nothing but add members to the community. Gatekeeping is corny.

Ultimately, it's up to the mods, yeah.

I mean who am I to really comment? But I agree with Sion. A PS2, controller and a copy of Ape 3 in US currency shouldn't run you more than like $90 max. I think if someone cares enough to take the game seriously they should have the hardware. There's nothing stopping you from practicing on emulator.

Also I'm not 100% but I'm fairly certain Ape 3 isn't even playable on PS4/5 in North America. The PS3 option is cheaper than PS2 and more optimal. I also dont know what PS Plus has to do with anything. You're biggest concern financially tbh is a capture card. I also agree that the game just isn't active enough to warrant a split. On the Klonoa topic that's way more understandable considering that game is gonna run you like $170 disc only. That being said though Klonoa is like $5 on PS3.

I'm also gonna be real, I didn't even know burning discs or using modded consoles was even allowed lmao.

But how does activity of the game on console speak to interest and activity on emulator? Within a couple days of posting this has attracted 3 people interested in doing emulator runs so who knows how many people looked at the rules and moved on because of them? I was almost one of those people before i saw this thread.

It's not just a matter of money, though that is a barrier, it's a matter of space, not everyone has the room to set up a console alongside their pcs, not everyone has the knowledge or time required to set all this extra stuff up, and emulator acts as an entry point for people to jump off from and decide if they want to go console in the future.

It just doesn't cost anything to let us compete against each other in our own little tab, the only other game I've run I would have never tried if emulation wasn't allowed, yet because it was it inspired me to try and get a console version of it eventually in a couple months when i can.

A PS2 is $80 minimum; some of those don't even come with a controller. A loose disc will run you $40. A PS3 will almost for sure be more expensive than a PS2. The only reason I even mentioned a PS4/5 is that PSN was brought up, so thanks for clearing that up. You also raise another point: people are required to get a capture card, another financial limitation. And as Gwenny pointed out, space is a major factor. People have limited room and time.

Also, just throwing this out there since it did get a mention in your comment: Klonoa (2008) doesn't run you $170 on disc; that is the original PS1 version "Door To Phantomile". The one I mentioned is $20-$25, has 19 total runners (less than 25% of this game), and sometime in the recent past, they made the distinction to separate emu/usb from consoles in their own tab. I think it cost them $0.

PS2 emulation is just not widely accepted because of multiple factors. Loads, offset global timers, texture and sounds issues etc. If you're paying $80 USD for a PS2 that's just wild. I have 5 Playstation 2 Consoles and I've never payed more than $35. I say PS3 is cheaper because Ape 3 is on the Psn store so you can skip paying $40 for a disc. I agree with you that Ape 3 will run you $40. But that is much less than a PC that could even run a PS2 emulator consistently or a modern game release.

I know having to spend money sucks and I've had to deal with it myself, but I did it because I really wanted to do it. As for a capture card, yeah ngl that can be expensive. Although I got mine for literally $10 but that was back in like 2018. I saw mine now goes for like $60. My advice for a PS2 is to get it through local marketplace, not a game store or ebay. You're probably stuck with Ape 3s price tag. As for space, idk guys a PS2 is smaller than a dinner plate and most people have a TV. As for knowledge, if you can download and run a emulator, and capture gameplay via OBS, you can setup a capture card and plug in a composite cable. I practiced on emulator for a long time before I could afford what I wanted.

You do know what financial limitations mean, right? In America, PSN ranges from $18 before tax per month to $160 before tax per year. That doesn't even include the cost of purchasing a PS4 or PS5. That's to run one single game the "optimal" way. And then you're talking about purchasing and modding a PS3 as if everyone has the money, time, or ability to do that either.

not sure what youre talking about. ape escape 3 was only ever released on ps2 and ps3 psn (japan only). you do not need any stupid subscriptions and nowadays you cant even buy ps3 psn games so youll need to mod it and spend 0usd on the game.

Also, you absolutely can just split this game into "disc" and "emulator/USB". It would be under the console. While the USB would act similarly to a burned disc. Klonoa (2008) made this distinction on their runner page. It's a single tab. Allowing more people to participate is in no way a bad thing and does nothing but add members to the community. Gatekeeping is corny.

if you split ape 3 into "disc" and "emulator/usb", where does the most optimal and most played version (PSN) go to? its neither disc nor comparable to emulators or usb loading. "it would be under console" you say but neither "disc" or "emulator/usb" is "console". usb also wouldnt be similiar to burnt disc, usb has load speeds depending on the usb, burnt disc has same loading speed as areal disc.

i also wouldnt call this gate keeping. youre more than welcome to play and run the game however you want, i just do not think there is a reason to have a whole separate board for emulators which for ps2 games have been wildly inaccurate.

not everyone has the knowledge or time required to set all this extra stuff up

come on in the discord! the community is lovely and is more than happy to help answer any and all relevant questions.

ive even put up a how to capture your game and how to mod your ps3 and get the psn version of ape3 on the wiki!

https://apewiki.siontea.com/Capturing

https://apewiki.siontea.com/AE3/PSN

emulator acts as an entry point for people to jump off from and decide if they want to go console in the future

and thats why you can run on it, no need to bother the mods to verify each and every emulator run that can vary greatly with their accuracy. ps2 emulation also requires a decent pc especially if you want to record/stream it.

people are required to get a capture card

incorrect. point your phone at the tv and start playing.

A PS2 is $80 minimum. A loose disc will run you $40

if you pay 80 usd for a ps2, youve been ripped off. cant comment on the disc prices but you can mod your ps2 for free and play a burned disc for free.

you can go to your local fleamarket, pick up a ps2 for like 20usd (power cable is generic and video cables can be bought cheap from like aliexpress), get your hands on a controller (i admit those prices can vary), mod the console, burn a disc and play. your total expense is like 50usd at very max (no controller will cost you 30usd).

PS2's composite cables aren't supported by the large majority of modern TV's, let alone capture cards. The barrier to entry with a physical PS2 I think is a bit too much. People are downplaying the cost, especially considering it might be something you might not even want to do for too long.

It removes the "I'll give it a try" factor. It's now a monetary investment and a hassle.

Other PS2 games allow emulators. I just checked Ratchet and Clank's for example, and they do - with specific requirements. I'm sure if I checked other popular PS2 titles (bar some exceptions) they'd allow emulators most of the time - or just have them in a separate category.

Honestly, the way I see it:

• If you want more people to run the game - allow emulators and minimise / negate any differences. I'm pretty sure this is not as big of an issue as it's being made out. They can be setup to be identical in most cases.
• If you don't want more people to run the game - don't allow emulators.

If there's some disparity caused by emulators, like load times or something - then that can be discussed at the time. It's not exactly a thriving category at the moment for this to be an issue. The same argument could be applied to SSD's and modded consoles.

PS2's composite cables aren't supported by the large majority of modern TV's, let alone capture cards.

there are some cheap scalers you can buy to convert component(or other) cables to hdmi. i myself use a "retroscaler 2x" which i got from aliexpress for 40€ in combination with my capturecard.

not sure if you specified composite on purpose but you can also get very cheap component cables, some more modern tvs might support those at least.

if we assume you have a ps3, you can record it through hdmi by buying one of those 10€ aliexpress hdmi capture cards that strip hdcp. and for a ps2, you can get the above mentioned scaler and use it with the 10€ capturecard. i believe drunk kami uses one of those cheap hdmi cards (im not a 100% dont quote me on that :D) and i know tohelot uses one.

People are downplaying the cost, especially considering it might be something you might not even want to do for too long.

"dont think youll be doing it for that long" is exactly should try out the run on emulator. if you like it enough to want to run it more seriously only then should you invest in the equipment, i think.

Other PS2 games allow emulators. I just checked Ratchet and Clank's for example, and they do - with specific requirements. I'm sure if I checked other popular PS2 titles (bar some exceptions) they'd allow emulators most of the time - or just have them in a separate category.

i checked a handful of ps2 games on src (ordered by popularity) and only found dbz budokai to allow emulators for ps2 (i separately checked crash twinsanity too which did allow emu on the leaderboards). funnily enough the sly games allowed ps3 emulation but had no mention of ps2 emulatiton.

The same argument could be applied to SSD's and modded consoles.

installing an ssd to your ps3 is normal imo and modded consoles make the game more accessible while using original hardware, but if you used a mod to make loads faster or something im fairly certain that would be disallowed as its an unfair advantage.

doing a quick search, at least in finland ps2s arent being sold much currently but i was able to find people selling slims for 30-40€ with controller(s) and a couple games. ps3s seem to be more redily avaivable right now and could find those for around 30-50€ too.

i may sound a bit harsh on emu but i wouldnt be mad if it was allowed, im just stating my opinion :P

everyone arguing against emulator are absolutely just jumping through hoops for no reason. Just make a seperate category. standardize the emulator settings and there will be more runs. Plus for non emulation yall are all saying its easy while for the actual optimal version of the game needing a MODDED PS3. that is not easy. and its also expensive. Just make another category for emulator its not THAT big of a deal jesus.

I would like to say i enjoy doing speedrun of old games and i wont lie i happen to have the consoles and the games physically. However i would like there to be a category for emulators as those same consoles has been on the fritz and emulators allows one to play and enjoy the games that are harder to obtain each year. heck even a time penalty would be fine as that would help incentivize new strategies and better routes

It is sad they are still banned.

Yeah it is tbh, I would've ran this game alot earlier if emulator was allowed. If you really want to run AE3 my advice would be to region unlock a PS2 (if it is not a Japanese model) and get the Japanese version disc because its cheaper and optimal for runs, or to homebrew a PS3 and "ethically" source the Japanese PSN download. I would say that the PS3 route is cheaper and better for runs anyway.