Forums  /  Pokémon Picross  /  About categories and ruleset updates
  CyndaKill-SHCyndaKill-SH

There are a bunch of different topics I'd like to discuss here, so... Let's get started ?

- 100% Areas rules clarification

A few days ago, we were routing 100% for the first Areas with qwertylool, and we noticed that the rules were quite unclear, especially about whether you have to respect some kind of puzzle order in the area (past Area 01, we can't really talk about an order since there are always puzzles that are out of the way to the next area) or if you could do the puzzles in whatever order you want. That might not seem very important, but it determines how you can plan your support Pokémon route, and that can cause major differences and time saves/losses.
So, do we have to go to the end of the area first by following some kind of any% path, then complete the other puzzles, or can we go for whatever order we like ?
(Timing rules should be changed to "timing starts at "Start!" on the first puzzle, and ends when the last mission is validated on the last puzzle" no matter what)

- What's the point of 100% ILs ?

I don't remember when or why 100% ILs were added, but I don't really see how they can be considered relevant. You just complete the level but you have to do a bunch of extra random useless stuff. Unlike for Areas in which you always add extra levels compared to Any% (except for 01), I don't think that's enough to justify another category.
Plus, the rules for them are the exact same as 100% Areas, so even if someone wanted do 100% IL runs (they would be first since there is currently no validated 100% IL run), they would have no indication for the timing (IGT/RTA, start and end if RTA) !

- "All Levels" Area runs

That might seem incoherent with what I said for 100% ILs, but I think we should add an All Levels category for Area runs (except 01) and full-game runs. That means you would complete every puzzle in the Area/game without bothering with missions. I think that would be a good "halfway point" between Any% and 100% that, imo, are way too different from each other.

- Alt World categories

As you may or may not know, Alt World levels have different missions, and especially, different LEVEL ORDERS from their Standard counterparts. And different level order often means puzzles that were "optional" in Standard become mandatory in Alt World. So, since the required puzzles in an alt world area are often different from its standard equivalent, I think adding Alt World any% would be a good idea for full game and areas that differ from standard ; also, with missions being entirely different, Alt World 100% should become a thing too, once again for both full game and area runs.

- Areas 200% ?

With the Alt World differences explained above, and given how much of a challenge the routing for an Area 100% run is, I'd also love to have 200% categories for Areas. Routing these should be a lot of fun, and even if completing the same puzzle twice in the same run might not sound great, I still think that could be a nice addition as the "ultimate" Area category.
(I didn't mention full game because noone has been enough of a madman to do a full-game 100% yet, so full-game 200% is probably not worth adding atm)

- Murals

Please ?

- The End

Yes, it's finally over. Congrats on reaching the end of this long ass post, thanks for reading, and let me know your thoughts about all of this 🙂

PS : Mods, if we agree on all or part of these changes, please give me mod, I'll do everything myself and "resign" afterwards ^^

qwertyloolqwertylool and DarQ_MassacresDarQ_Massacres like this. 
  DarQ_MassacresDarQ_Massacres

ok, so. If I remember correctly it was originally my idea to add the 100% categories and here is the main reason for them. the 100% category is not just beating all the levels but it is to beat all of the quests on each level. so that would be the main difference between any% and 100%. as for the 100% IL's it would mean that you need to beat the level while completing all of the quests for that level. so the timing would be the same as the normal IL's where it would show the completion time at the end. The runs would not have to be in a specific order so long as the run completes each level and completes all the quests for each level. The Alt world is a completely other subject and should have it's own subcategory for it so that would be Alt-Any% and Alt-100%. This would also allow the idea for a 200% category which would be 100% on both normal and Alt world. possibly even a sort of 50% category for both Any% (Maybe not, I haven't looked at the Alt world much) and as for Murals I thought they were already added but maybe I was wrong.

I hope this answered some stuff and if there is still some unclear parts let me know 🙂

qwertyloolqwertylool likes this. 
  Pokemon73Pokemon73

What about branching even further by doing stylus and button categories, that way there are 2 different ways to speedrun

 
  DarQ_MassacresDarQ_Massacres

I feel like branching out with stylus and button categories would make the boards too cluttered (which they already kind of are)

 
  Pokemon73Pokemon73

Well it would be like the MK8/MK8D where they have 150cc category and 200cc category, so it could work like that

 
  CyndaKill-SHCyndaKill-SH

We'll already have 30+ categories, most of them divided in 6 subcategories, if all of the changes I suggested happen, so doubling that just for button controls is a big no.
What we could do, though, is what they do on the Forbidden Memories leaderboard for RNG manip ( https://www.speedrun.com/yugiohfm ) : have a "Controls" option in the run submission menu, show it on the leaderboard, and have both runs show up for people that have a stylus PB and a buttons PB (look for GFC's runs on the FM leaderboard if you don't understand).

Thanks for your answers DarQ_Massacres ! Replying to your post now :upside_down:
- What about All Levels tho
- If you really want to keep 100% ILs, IGT is pretty dumb, since, unlike any%, you can use Freeze Time and get a 0:00 in every puzzle. What about RTA timing from level select to "last mission validated" ? 🙂
- "Double Any%". Completing an area in either Standard or Alt World is enough to unlock next area on both, and no routing would be required (which was my main point for 200%), so unlike 200% it'd just be Any% + Alt World Any% with no changes at all, and I don't think that's worth a separate category.
- In conclusion, if I got it right, for 100% I can go in whatever order I want, and you'd be ok with murals, Alt-World any/100, and 200% ? If yes, please mod me so that I can add these already ^^

qwertyloolqwertylool and Pokemon73Pokemon73 like this. 
  qwertyloolqwertylool

On 100% Areas: IMO we should go like Any% and have it go in order, like if you were playing from a new file, but it doesn’t really matter to me and we can do whatever. I care a lot more in Any%, as you’re supposed to be pretending you’re on a new file, but on 100%, it gets a lot less clear, especially since we use pokemon unlocked a lot later (this is needed in basically every area). Actually, because of that, it would probably make a lot more sense to go in any order then. You aren’t even trying to pretend it’s a new file, as you can’t.

(Also do the timing rule changes, except we should clarify if it’s based on when it first appears/dissaprears or the sound cue)

On 100% ILs: I guess I thought they had a purpose, but looking at it now, it would be a total mess switching between RTA and IGT, and also the only level differences would include more RNG (aka what we all hate). A large portion of the levels wouldn’t even have any differences between 100% and any%.

On All Levels: I totally see where you’re coming from, but idk if it would be really too different from 100%. I do think that Any% and 100% become very different, but the only difference between All Levels and 100% is using pokemon, which doesn’t make it seem too different IMO. I could see this coming into consideration again if we find out 100% sucks to grind because of support pokemon, but right now I think it would be too much leaderboard clutter, especially considering the highest area that has been ran is 7.

On Alt World: I almost agree, except it would double the amount of subcategories, which may make it a bit confusing. I understand where you’re coming from though, and IMO they should be added (although it may clutter the boards a lot). Except not ILs, because doubling the amount of ILs would suck and there is no difference.

On 200%: 200% Makes sense, as it would be completing each world to its fullest extent. I’d probably want to see this added more than the Alt World categories, although it could end up becoming boring to run.

On Murals: Please? (Except I haven’t even fully unlocked them yet lol)

 
  DarQ_MassacresDarQ_Massacres

Sorry about the late reply, but I figure I should explain myself a little bit better on the difference between 100% and all levels would be. so, each level has 3 challenges that can be completed such as using specific pokemon or specific abilities. for 100% you would need to beat all of those levels while also completing all of the challenges. for all levels however, you just need to beat all of the levels on the board, you do not have to do the challenges. The order for 100% areas I feel shouldn't matter as some later worlds are kind of a mess on where pokemon are located. the Alt world I feel would only really be needed for if we add 200%, other than that the difference between alt world and any% wouldn't really be that much. and the murals I will add as well.