I was wondering if we could maybe change or discuss changing the timing of this speed run to use In game time. the reason behind this being it is tough to keep same or similar timing between consoles and load times based on how good your disc drive reads(remember its pretty old hardware now). Also that allows people to load and run from a hard drive load because it won't effect timing .
I understand your concern and I am open to change. Adding an in-game time column wouldn't be a bad idea if the game provided a file timer, but it does not. What do you propose happens to the game timer if you restart a race, as the 100% does?
Would it be fair that anytime spent in a race is added to time(of that track) even if the runner has to redo the race or choose's to restart the race due to thinking they will loose/bad start?
Yes, but how much time do you add? It's hard to tell especially during the run to see what the timer is at when you restart. This is the same problem with doing IGT in games like Super Monkey Ball, but it's even easier in that game because it shows a still timer when the game is paused. In this game, the timer disappears. Additionally, if I were to look through at the last time shown before a pause, it could be inaccurate if somebody is recording or streaming at 30fps instead of 60fps, or especially if there are some dropped frames. It simply doesn't seem feasible, but maybe a loadless plugin would work better.
I see why recording IGT on a track restart will not be reliable.
I'd like to figure out some IGT alternative as well. Mainly because the 2 PS2 times for Z runs have a large difference between loading times, and then EpicNeonNinjaMonkey and myself have found the same thing on Xbox. It's pretty much un-runnable for Epic when using a disc because it's too much of a disadvantage. There are always some differences between console models/laser health, but It seems drastically different than other disc based games I have ran for some reason.
I have an idea for an alternative but I don't know if it would be an appropriate rule. What if there is a rule that says restarting races on Individual Story is not allowed? Or a rule that says IGT submission is only allowed when a run has no restarts. It only took a few completed runs from both of us to get to the point where restarting a track is not a viable option. So it shouldn't raise the bar for entry too much.
Sounds good. I would like to request that going forward you look into using in-game time through manual livesplit entries. Totalling up everything post run would be a nuisance for everybody, confusing to a viewer, and harder to verify. Additionally, if RTA is as useless as you say it is, it shouldn't be too much of an issue.
In resources, I have uploaded an example template livesplit layout file. It has a smaller RTA timer up top and an IGT timer at the bottom (with decimals). When you begin a session using your standard split key, a window pops up. By entering the segment time, it will add it as an entry to your splits. Feel free to ignore RTA until the end of the run, but do submit it as the secondary timing method. If a race is ever retried, leave IGT submissions blank. If you would like a previous run of yours retimed, just edit the submission with an accurate IGT for re-verification. As a courtesy, I have done this for all eligible current personal bests for everybody. Of course, feel free to change around the livesplit layout file to your liking to match your stream's theme or personal preference, and if you have any questions, this is not a bad place to reach me.
Cool, this sounds like a reasonable solution. Thanks for making the layout and going through to update the times. Really appreciate it :)
Well this will be a pain to look through my entire 100% run and give you an accurate IGT then...
I checked the rules and it seems the "don't apply IGT if a race is restarted" is on 100% too. Which for the time being, until i or someone else can somehow perfect run an entire hour and a half of this game without failing a single run, which i have shown the AI and game physics make it pretty unfair on that part especially on the later stuff like Cutter and Mandible, i feel like this makes IGT useless because of this rule for 100%. Which if we're to make IGT the important time here, makes 100% a current empty spot in that position.
Also, how will this apply with penalties from stuff like Bala's 5th level? Do i use the time i got from beating the level or do i apply to 2-8 second penalties to it? Which btw, some of the flag spots are unbelievable bullshit and the game tries it's hardest to prevent you from getting some of them, so...
I can be cool with that. Though there's still the issue with the penalty additions with some characters individual story's levels. Best to know if penalties will be added to the time or not for those incase you guys decide to go past Z for this game.
Honestly, it's up to you guys. I get both sides of it. Do you want to optimize the penalty races for RTA or IGT? Either is fine as long as it's agreed upon.
100% will be RTA by default until a flawless (no track resets) run is finished anyway.
