Illinois, USAI've yet to see anyone else get the level 1 boss quick kill that fast. It's not possible on a gamepad unless I'm completely missing something. I'm aware of the subweapon super speed strat, but increasing your regular attack speed to do an extra 2-3 strikes with your sword? I'm not kidding when I said I spent hours trying to get it once. I tried an emulator, turbo, real NES, etc. It was only when I switched over to keyboard that I was able to replicate the 2nd flame quick kill. I was able to get in a couple extra strikes with my sword that can't be done on a gamepad (as far as I'm aware).
It's unknown how much time could be saved using a keyboard, whether it's utilized at its potential or not. Faster inputs, left + right combos, easier subweapon use, wall climbs, etc. When you single them out it's not a huge deal. If wall climbs save 1-2 seconds, not a big deal. But when you add in (potentially) faster boss kills, easier subweapon use, etc. it starts to add up.
I love the community we are all a part of and the purity of speedrunning. Just like we don't allow people to cheat or use special tools or splice together videos. It is just as important that things be fair across all boards. Wherever you end up on the leaderboards is based purely on skill, not because someone may or may not have had a slight advantage over others.
Anyhow, you guys are the mods here, whatever decision is made, I'm certain it will be in the best interest of the NG3 community. Thanks again for having this discussion and looking into things.
I'm not entirely sure either. I'm almost certain Xiuluowentian's run was done on a keyboard, as you can hear the keys as he's pressing them. They do not sound like a controllers buttons being pressed. But his run is fantastic, keyboard or not, he has crazy skills and it is not my intent to discredit them.
However, I feel like even separating them into console/emulator categories is still saying that keyboards should be allowed. For all those who can't afford a console and must use an emulator would still have the unfair advantage placed on them. It would almost be forcing them to use keyboards as well, just to compete with fairness.
Maybe the only fair thing to do to keep things fair among all runners is to create a separate "Keyboard" category. And post a new rule somewhere saying that Keyboards should not be allowed unless in the special category. That's all I've got off the top of my head.
Thoughts?
I'm fairly new to NG3 speedruns. But I have almost 2 years of NG1 speedrunning practice under the belt as well as several other games. And from what I know of NG1 and NG2 is that the keyboard allows inputs faster than a real NES controller can output.
For example. I have used my real NES controller and practiced the quick kill for the 1st boss in the US version, for several hours. I can kill him slightly after his 3rd flame, as other runners have achieved. However, even with a turbo controller, which is obviously cheating, I can't get the same speeds that the WR video has, killing the boss on the 2nd flame. Even when I mimic the exact movements, pixel-perfect positioning and attacks, I can't strike my sword as fast as in the video. The US WR video gets in 2 extra strikes that are simply not possible with a controller, saving time on the run. To be sure, I tested things with a keyboard and sure enough, I could kill the boss on the 2nd flame, same as the US WR video. My attacks were noticeably faster and wall climbing was also easier to get consistent on.
There is a reason keyboard use is not allowed in Ninja Gaiden 1 & 2. I think keyboard use should NOT be allowed for runs in the top 10 or so spots for any NES Ninja Gaiden game, let alone a WR run, which I believe was done on the US NG3 run (you can clearly hear the keyboard inputs). I understand that real hardware is expensive and not everyone can get their hands on them, but when we are talking a WR, we need to be as fair and clear about things as possible.
To be clear, I am not calling anyone a cheater. Using a keyboard is not cheating, but it is, in my opinion, an unfair advantage to using a controller as it makes certain things easier and inputs are faster. I think the rules for NG3 have been too slack since it's not as popular as the other two in the series.
I ask that the NG3 mods please take my consideration into account and look into it. If it is agreed upon, then please look into the current NG3 US WR video and see if you agree that a keyboard was used. If you believe it to be so, perhaps making a separate" keyboard use" category would mitigate things. I do not wish to discredit the amazing run done by Xiuluowentian, simply because he used a keyboard (if he did).
Thank you for taking a look at my request.
Hey huge thanks! very much appreciated. I like to get as much info as I can about a game from different angles, runners, etc. It helps me see possible time saves and reasons that certain things are done. Anyhow, again, big thanks!
Beco took a leave of absence for personal reasons and removed all his records. Beco said he will be back in 2018 sometime, in which case he may resubmit all his records.
I'm getting ready to run PR and was told there is a beginners guide floating around somewhere. I see Sidetrakkd's guide, which I was told is more advanced.
Anyone know of the other guide? I'd like to get as much information as possible.
Also, is there a PR Discord?
Thanks everyone
Just saw that the Mega Man SR.com page now says "The community is tracking this board at megamanleaderboards.net until a time at which API synchronization between the two sites is developed or circumstances change."
I feel like that's exactly what I was hoping for. Thanks :P
I'm sure this has been brought up many times. But I wanted to address it here, on my own accord.
Firstly, when it comes to records, SR.com is #1. So much so, that many runners refuse to run Mega Man games simply because they don't want to use the Megamanleaderboards, which is sad that it comes to that, but it stresses the need for changes to be made regarding the Mega Man game series.
I'm sure both leaderboards have their reasons for keeping the games separate. But not everyone knows about the Megamanleaderboards. Whatever the reason, there has to be a simple solution.
Perhaps something as simple as listing each Mega Man game and then placing a link to the Megamanleaderboards site, so people know it exists. Or perhaps it's far more complex, such as talking to the owners of the site and working out some sort of merge or API to sync between. I do not have the technical know-how to suggest something further than that. However, I strongly feel that something like that needs to happen.
If all my speedrun records are on SR.com, then why should I be forced to use the Megamanleaderboards.net site just for my Mega Man records? It seems wrong and inconvenient for everyone, both those who want to see the records and the runner themselves.
As I stated previously, I'm sure this has been brought up more than once. And therefore I am sorry for repeating what has been presented in the past. However, I believe there is a solution somewhere.
Thanks for your time.
Can we get a way to add "likes" or comments to speedruns? I'm not saying we make this a social platform. It just makes sense that we should be able to comment on runs.
_ "So&So get's a new WR in Such&Such" ¤367 thumbs up¤
"hey great job! Well done!" "WR HYPE!" "I knew you could do it!" _
Some of these runners don't have a Twitter account. Or maybe they don't stream regularly, so it's hard to catch them online to congratulate them or to add some encouragement.
Adding an option to send personal messages would also be a great feature. Sure you can ask questions on forums, but it's sometimes easier to just message someone directly.
It should be in the settings whether or not to allow people to message you or not. If you don't want private messages, that's fine, turn it off, no more PMs. But I'd argue that the vast majority of people wouldn't mind getting a question here or there.
All this interactivity would have some downsides. I understand that. We'd have the occasional troll, which is why a "report" feature would need to be added. Which is pretty standard. It would also mean a little more work for mods and admins. To deal with those reports. Website bugs and such aren't that difficult to overcome, especially when the community is made of techies. But overall, the good would heavily outweigh the bad.
Just some basic suggestions, nothing too crazy. This would really add some personal interaction to the site. This is a great community. And from what I've seen over the past year is that most people are encouraging and want to add hype to accomplishments. We should encourage users to do so with comments and thumbs ups.
I honestly don't see what the problem is. I think meme/challenge run categories should be acceptable if there are people running them. On the contrary, standard categories such as Pacifist, any%, No Pickups, etc. should remain as they are, the heart of the speed category lists.
We as speedrunners should be able to speedrun a game as we choose, then put it up to a vote of sorts, as to whether or not it should be added in as a meme category. I agree that this is a community site. Without the community, there isn't much here. So it should be voted upon and discussed. Should feet% become a category? Put it to a vote. Are there enough people doing feet% to add it in as a category? Is one person doing feet% worthy of being added as a meme category?
I bring these up because they aren't decisions that should be decided on by one person or a few people, but opened up for people to give their two cents on, if they care to. I'm not a mod and I have great respect for the mods here. But I also have a lot of respect for the hundreds of hours someone may have put in for a category that currently doesn't exist. And due to the final decision of a few, never will.
Speedrunning records of all kinds should be recognized for the hard work committed to them. Not just standard any%, pacifist, etc. However, all categories, especially the meme ones, need to be more clearly defined. What is low% vs pacifist? What is minimalistic vs low%?? Let's very clearly define each category...defined rules are a must if we are to have meme categories at all.
Just my two cents on the subject. Hope I didn't ramble too much. With that said, I'd like to thank the mods as well as the runners of all categories, standard and meme, for all your continued hard work. It's why this community website exists.
That's great to hear! A very welcomed addition to the site for certain! Thank you
I'm not sure about NG 2, but in NG 1, if you wall climb too fast, even with a controller, when you go into the next screen, you can go through the bottom of the wall and will usually die. It's a very common thing in which most runners learn very quickly to wait a second before doing any climbing. Again, I do not know if it's the same in NG2 or not.
Either way, thanks for posting your discovery.
A normal NES dpad will not allow for left+right key presses at the same time. There are many TAS tricks like this in Ninja Gaiden 1 as well, but they can only be done with a keyboard or emulator (TAS). Therefore, they are not possible or permitted in actual runs unless someone were to discover a way of doing it on a standard NES brick controller.
It can actually be done on a Dogbone controller on real NES hardware too. Broken Dogbone controllers are known to do this as well. However, since it is do specific to keyboards, emulators, and the Dogbone...its not allowed.
So, something I'd love to see within this site, is the ability to follow runners. You can follow specific games, which is fantastic, but sometimes, you want to see all the games a specific runners plays.
Maybe I follow someone on Twitch, but can't be there to watch all the time. And would like to know when they get a new PB or WR, so I can go and congratulate them. But if I'm not following the specific games that runner is playing, I wouldn't be notified until I was able to watch them on Twitch, maybe a week or two later.
It would be very beneficial to everyone if you could follow the runners you really like watching but can't spend every waking moment stalking their Twitch. Please make this happen.
[To the web devs: I wanted to report a bug with your contact link (why I'm posting this in the forums instead of contacting you guys directly). Currently, if I click on the "Contact" link, nothing happens. I can see in the HTML that it's supposed to send a user to their email with the address "contact@speedrun.com" but I was unable to locate the "fa fa-at" class in the CSS to determine what the cause might be, as the HTML looks good. Anyhow, thought I'd point this out to you.]
