There's a whole bunch of ties on the leaderboard (a three-way tie for 2nd and a tie for 5th), wondering what others' thoughts are on adding milliseconds to times via retiming in order to break the ties? Game's pretty short after all.

Hey, I also have been running this game. I have some thoughts on leaderboard organization:

1. I think subcategories for individual chapters of the story would be valuable. I personally would have difficulty running the entire story mode at once for health reasons but I plan to run every chapter individually.

2. ILs for event mode stages would be cool to add as well.

3. Game rules currently do not exist. I feel run submissions should at the very least require audio. I haven't done extensive testing on framerate but it doesn't appear to meaningfully impact anything. A load remover probably won't be necessary as loads are instant. If the game had IGT that would be cool but most stages don't, so... I have also observed that the game has an extremely strong anti-cheat. I messed around with Cheat Engine and the game automatically crashes if you complete a stage while it's open, instead of auto-saving, even if Cheat Engine isn't attached to the game process. At least, it does for me - I assume this is universal as I've heard other accounts of it. So that's cool.

4. Characters should probably be a non-subcategory variable. Choosing your character is part of the strategy. I don't think it makes much sense to separate them since basically everyone is going to pick the fastest character once that is discovered. It would also be helpful if they were sorted alphabetically.

5. I'd like to moderate for the game. If given moderator I'm happy to implement whatever changes we agree on.

I did a chapter 1 Challenge run earlier today, will be working on subsequent chapters as I have time:

It occurs to me we probably should include something in the rules about not obscuring boss HP bars with splits etc, even if that invalidates the above run...

I used to be able to follow very large amounts of games, but since the major update a month or two ago I have been capped at 100. Trying to follow more gives a pop-up error saying "user cannot follow more games." Not sure why this cap was implemented, and it seems that there are some people with well over 100 games followed, presumably from before the update. Any way around this limitation?

Made a shmup speedrun discord in order to discuss strategies/consolidate info etc https://discord.gg/WW8UQ9WBd2

PS1 and Saturn have load times that Arcade does not, and also run at 60fps as opposed to 57.5 (about 4.3% faster). X360 version has correct framerate but it and the Saturn port do not have slowdown or have incorrect slowdown in many segments (The x360 version is a full copy of the game in a visual novel also made by CAVE called Instant Brain which costs over $100 now, FWIW) meaning they will get times much faster than other versions can achieve. X360 version in particular will be almost 30 seconds ahead after 2 stages because of this and over a minute and a half faster in a full run (I have a TAS of the arcade version using faster strategies than the new 1cc WR and it is still slower because X360 has incorrect slowdown. I am happy to make a side-by-side comparison).

Managing slowdown is part of the speedrun (killing enemies on screen quickly to prevent them flooding the screen with bullets that cause slowdown) and playing on certain versions removes that element almost entirely. The arcade version is the original and thus should be considered the standard, and the fastest possible time for a 1cc on that is in the 17:30ish range.

Source for platform differences:

I'd also like to moderate for this game if possible, I don't have a completed run yet but I've been practicing for a 1cc and have a pretty thorough route and a TAS of it, and I moderate a few other shmups.

Please set the number of players for 1P subcategory to 1 or otherwise reorganize the board to fix this. I have a run I cannot submit because SRC claims I "don't have enough players" even though I am trying to submit for the 1P category.

The run in question:

Also, why are emulator runs hidden by default? A fairly decent number of people are going to be emulating this game on MAME.

Special Version differences:

1. Game has 4 loops, each increasing in difficulty
2. Player hitbox is significantly smaller
3. Bombs act like co-op bombs even in single player (triple damage bombs of standard version)
4. In addition to the peach pigs that give score, there are lavender pigs that give exp. The primary impact this has on the speedrun is making level 3 shot possible before the stage 3 boss.
5. The player gets a one-hit shield every time the exp bar is filled. This amounts to 2-3 hits that can be used strategically or to cover mistakes throughout a run.

The end result this has is that the first loop of Special is much easier than completing standard Batsugun. This is a much more beginner-friendly shmup.

The ship types are separated because B is much better than the other two by every conceivable metric, especially since this game has built-in autofire (for the record, I would allow autofire even if it weren't built in - protect your hands, you only get one pair).

Hi, I saw there is no 1cc/1-ALL category. I think that should be added since it is a completely different way of playing (can't credit feed to spam bombs on bosses, which is the only way to decrease time besides avoiding slowdown). I am working on a 1cc at the moment (alongside ones for DoDonPachi and the original Batsugun).

There are also several version differences:

• JP version is considered the "standard" version.
• US version is much easier as it refills your bombs every stage and has lower "rank" (internal difficulty that affects bullet speed and count)
• Korean version is much the same as JP except the first boss has an easier final pattern.
• Hong Kong version is the hardest as the player's hitbox is larger and the starting rank is higher than JP.

In particular I would advocate splitting US/All other versions due to the difference in bomb count which is the primary factor in speed.

Source: https://shmups.wiki/library/DonPachi#Versions

It also seems a tad strange that the only category involves finishing both loops. I would imagine it would be beneficial to have a 2-loop category and a 1-loop category - the only argument I can see for not having a 1-loop category is that there are no requirements for entering the second loop or fighting the TLB.

Firstly, I think the timing method for this game, rather than RTA, should be Sum of IGT. The reasons for this proposed change are as follows:

1. Load time differences between platforms become irrelevant, and platforms can be grouped together. This removes the need for a platform subcategory and declutters the board.
2. Load time differences on the same console due to hard drive swaps (for example replacing your PS4's hard drive with an SSD) or load time differences due to different PC specs also become irrelevant, leveling the playing field for players who cannot afford such things.
3. Install skill drops do not cause random timeloss.
4. Runners on PS4 or PS5 can capture directly from their console, removing the need for a capture card.
5. IGT continues counting through cutscene attacks and Extella Maneuver and is impossible to abuse.

I say all this as someone who has the game installed on an NVMe SSD (2TB Firecuda 530), meaning I have a significant advantage over PC players who are using an HDD and don't have $200+ to drop on that kind of SSD with the current timing method.

Basically, Sum of IGT encourages fair competition more than the current rule set in this game. I am happy to retime every run on the board with the new timing method if it is implemented and I am made a moderator.

Note that, in the event this new timing method were implemented, RTA would still be preserved and displayed alongside the IGT.

Secondly, I think Side Stories should be organized differently for clarity and neatness. Rather than being miscellaneous categories, "Side Story" should be a single category with subcategories for all the stories in a drop-down. This would make the board look neater and make it easier to find the desired subcategory. Main story should be organized the same way. Difficulties should be upgraded to subcategories, because at the moment there is no reason to ever play on anything other than easy mode.

Thirdly, I would like individual levels added to the boards. Specifically, the individual chapters of the main and side stories. Free Battle is pretty much impossible to add because of the layout so I can live without that.

Fourth, the rules should be more specific. There should be an audio requirement in order to prevent splicing in run submissions, and it should be encouraged but not necessarily enforced to display an FPS counter for PC runs

Fifthly, I would like to moderate for this game:

1. I am on SRC daily and I verify runs within 48 hours as a rule.
2. I moderate for several other Musou games (including this game’s sequel) and am knowledgeable on this one.
3. I will handle my proposed leaderboard changes (altering categorization, adding ILs). As previously stated, if sum of IGT is implemented, I will manually retime all runs in a publicly visible spreadsheet (for transparency). I have already retimed all the side story runs.
4. Having two moderators is almost always better than having one.

Hi, curious about adding a category for the Master Rank Colosseum Battle, I have a run for it from back in 2018:

Not sure if it would be better as a single IL or as a separate category (probably under Misc categories) etc.

This is the original PS4 release. Happy to submit through normal channels once they exist.

Rules would be to start time on selecting the Master Colosseum and end time on the last frame of the battle rewards UI moving into place.

The game is no longer available to buy from PSN. Please make a separate board or allow emulator (in a separate subcategory if necessary) so that competition is possible. A disc time will lose 10+ minutes compared to the downloaded version.

I have some thoughts on the leaderboard organization.

Changing the timing method for this game to Sum of IGT would benefit the game by removing load discrepancies between hard drive types (SSD/HDD), as well as console vs. emulator. IGT continues through supers etc. and is difficult/impossible to abuse. Testing has revealed that IGT is even tied to framerate so degenerate strategies such as abusing lag (e.g. using hyper bazookas in a crowd) will not save time.

Another benefit of IGT is that time spent in menus such as the skills menu and Mobile Suits menu would not count towards the total, so that switching between skill setups or certain suits that might be more optimal for a given mission becomes viable, therefore giving a place for more of the game's mechanics in the speedrun. In addition, 8-star Hard becomes a viable subcategory for NG+ story modes (for the same reason).

Emulator should be added because it is soon going to be the only way to acquire this game, since it's locked to PS3. PS3 emulation has come a long way since this board was established and it's very stable. The DLC is already unobtainable outside of modded consoles and provides a significant advantage in NG+ runs. It is available on emulator but a simple subcategory variable (split between console/emu) will resolve this. There is one problem that previously caused crashing on emulator but there is a patch for it: https://wiki.rpcs3.net/index.php?title=Dynasty_Warriors%3A_Gundam_Reborn Emulator reduces lag from having lots of enemies on the screen and so can make the game a more enjoyable experience.

I would also like to moderate for this game:

1. I am on SRC daily and I verify runs within 48 hours as a rule.
2. I mod for several other Musou games and am highly knowledgeable on this one.
3. If sum of IGT is implemented, I will manually retime all runs in a publicly visible spreadsheet (for transparency). I will also handle my proposed leaderboard changes (e.g. adding ILs).

Hi, just thought I'd ask if it was possible to split the Arcade Mode leaderboard up by character (into ILs). I'm interested in running with other characters but currently there's no reason to do so. Similar to Persona 4 Arena Ultimax's leaderboard: https://www.speedrun.com/persona_4_arena_ultimax/levels

Also story mode is not on the board, personally I feel it makes sense for that to be the "full-game" category. I will be doing a run of it today or tomorrow.

Thanks.

Hey, new to Drakengard speedrunning and interested in learning this game, just wanted to ask/mention some things.

First, I saw a forum post saying that ILs will be added - the post was made about 2 years ago, but currently the only available ILs are the DLCs. Are the main game ILs still planned to be added?

Second question, presumably "official console hardware with no modifications" means no SSD even if CFW isn't used? I would be running on emulator anyway since I have the disc version on console, but it seems odd to me to require longer loads and makes that version of the game arguably not worth running at all.

Third isn't really a question, but the Discord link doesn't work, otherwise I would have asked these questions there.

Thanks in advance!

Does 2P require two actual players, or does it just mean playing the game in 2P mode? E.g., would I be allowed to control two ships by myself using two controllers? Or would that end up as a separate category, possibly requiring handcam?

IGT is accurate, and takes into account cutscenes but not loads, meaning it equalizes across platforms with different levels of DLC access (such as PC/Switch). While I play on PC, I would like to see this change as it would provide a more level playing field. The only caveat I can see is that it would become very efficient to quit-out in order to refresh skill cooldowns, but that's already always going to be cheaper RTA than waiting for them to refill, so it doesn't really incur a cost as it is.

This technique is significantly faster than the aerial knife throw used in some of the runs here. Would add under guides but I don't appear to have the necessary permissions to do so.

Are we allowed to use any character for ILs? I don't see a mention in any rules that we aren't but there's also no subcategories or variables mentioning different characters, and surely they're not all equal in terms of speed. For example, I have multiple IL runs with Curly Brace that are pretty quick, but I'm pretty sure it's not fair to compare her to Aban because she's so much faster what with the air dash.

Looking at running this...since this game is only available digitally in the West, would playing on SSD significantly improve load times? If so, should that be a variable on the boards? Or is it not worth it because of the console's bus speed limits? I've seen it make a difference for a few PS3 games but wasn't sure if any testing had been conducted on this one.

Is it alright if I post the save I used for my Mission Mode NG+ WR under Resources, possibly also with a link to the PS3 save re-signing tool so that others can make use of it? I'm aware this game gets very little attention, but having a save available with maxed-out characters would drastically reduce the amount of time needed to prepare runs of the NG+ categories.

Also, separate topic, but I'm planning on doing some IL runs. Is there a way we can get individual missions added to the LB? Not sure I can ask for mod but if I had it I'd just do that myself.