Or rather all others got nerfed. I was routing for higher Opinion Leader levels and noticed something: 53done's OP levels up in the Usar fight. This is impossible in English SNES unless you also kill a Wizard. Japanese TASer vibtration uses Lans in the Warren Fight and his OP still levels up against Usar.
I figured out why. In the original Super Famicom release, EXP gain is calculated as if the enemy is 2 levels higher than in all other releases: English SNES, both PSX, Saturn and Super Famicom Nintendo Power.
The implication for speedrunning is your characters get an automatic level up if the enemy is 4 levels higher in original Super Famicom, whereas it's 6 in the rest. Tarot kill EXP for OP is also not nerfed in the original.
You might like to know that the original Super Famicom has boosted enemy unit counts on all but 4 stages, making it badly designed since a causal playthrough will power level.
I played ran original Super Famicom through Island Avalon to confirm the leveling. Here's the breakdown for any% with identical routing:
I hijacked Dragondarch's formatting. Level in the box is level after the battle ends if the character survives. Gryphon also benefits. Can live or die in Usar fight, doesn't matter. Will gain 1 level for surviving Gilbert or Sirius and 2 if it survives both. In all other releases, Gryphon only gains 1 level if it survives both Gilbert and Sirius.
Is a faster Warren's Castle clear and a 1-2 level advantage significant enough to put original Super Famicom in its own category?
I'm not sure. There was always going to be a best version to run, Japanese text was always faster and Dragon's Haven/Heaven is unaffected. Game is much more popular in Japan and is very playable in Japanese.
But yeah, Tarot cards are more powerful, damage dealt is ticked up and damage taken is ticked down. Extra AGI on Tristan/Debonair is nice. I have no evidence of any change in damage formulas.
I'll wait a little longer for comments on the start of run thread before making rules changes and retiming. If you want to retime your own runs, go for it.
Before retiming, I have to wonder, what about the end of the run? As in, what does "final hit" mean?
- @Dragondarch ends at start of the death sound playing.
- @Krayzar ends very slightly earlier than the sound starting.
- @bizarreluck ends at start of death sound, however the rest of the Hermit animation continues to play. This saves 4 seconds.
- @Spockrocket on Ianuki ends after the final hit lands, before the feedback damage or death sound. This saves 1-2 seconds.
Everyone timed with the final rule correctly but in interpretations that were fastest. I realize it's hilarious to be all legalese here over a few seconds. Issue is 1-4 seconds is significant in a 1 stage map. I don't like the idea of an attack being better if it's the final hit either.
My proposal and open to other proposals: "final hit" means start of death sound and completion of attack animation. As in, if Chariot/Devil/Hermit is used, card has to finish animating.
If you time with damage number disappearing instead of death sound starting or however Krayzar did it, that's fine. Maybe a runner here one day is deaf or hard of hearing.
On a fresh game you have no cards. CesarD's and BOSSCAT's runs use no cards. Meanwhile, FelipeNascimento83's runs on easy and normal use attack up and defense up cards, which is fair to say a huge advantage. Using previous saved game data is normally not allowed in speedruns either.
Basically, the main category should be no cards. Fine to have a separate category that allows them. There is some strategy of which 2 of the 4 cards to apply and cards make the game easier/more accessible.
Strange me looking at just about every RPG being run in Japanese for less time lost to text and seeing it banned here. I could understand banning the original Japanese release on the left and allowing the Japanese International edition on the right.
The changes in the English NTSC and PAL releases were somewhat significant with new cut scenes and famously added Ruby and Emerald weapon. The later International release does have them and presumably is in line with the Western changes:
If you separate the languages and have them compete independently from each other, then I think that's fairly uncontroversial and doesn't bar anyone who may only own the game in Japanese from being able to submit a run at all.
I hope this isn't an obvious question. What I can find after digging around is:
the Usamune Practice Rom will not work with your Everdrive/ED64 and on Gameshark you are limited to only 13 lines of code, which means you will be unable to use most practice codes.
Is that it? The Expansion Pack has no direct impact on Super Mario 64? I thought maybe, possibly, it would have faster read/write than the bundled RAM.
Recommended changes
- I think the explanation of why to buy an OEM Expansion Pack should be in alaris' linked N64 Buyer's Guide in Resources.
N64 Setup Guide for SM64 - Google Docs under alaris' link in Resources:
- The guide must be years old because it's recommending buying a Sony PVM/BVM. A 20" mono PVM that does RGB runs well over $1000 USD today and a BVM is looking like $2000 + has no audio inputs. Let's not recommend pro monitors anymore! Sad seeing people show off their 9" pro Sony monitors on Reddit that have lower TVL than consumer 15" sets that get dumped on the curb. Further, JVC, Ikegami and others made nice pro CRT monitors that go for less.
- The guide has an AmaRecTV setup versus OBS and gives AmaRecTV more weight. Years ago I could understand but I think I can say without controversy that there is no reason to use AmarecTV over OBS today, unless you have a very specific reason. Like you want to capture off of Windows XP. The guide even links's EvilAsh25's updated streaming guide that states to use OBS instead of AmRec. EvilAsh25 Streaming Setup Guide - Google Docs
Powering through the game has entertainment value but why is there no timing on the first run to completion? With infinite time, can stat item boost a full team, get all the endgame spells and equipment and Ogre Blade abuse for optimal skillsets. That's fine but a timing price has to be paid.
Chrono Trigger has no NG+ only leaderboard, Chrono Cross times all 3 runs for all characters. Is there any precedent to not count the first run?
I think it's further unfitting that secretbunnyninja has two NG+ runs on the same leaderboard.
Given the time required, I can understand allowing at least 1 break of any length with no time penalty so long as the run is continued without using a splice or segment. As in, if you're streaming, keep the stream going.
Hori made SNES/SFC controllers ostensibly for fighting games with the L and R buttons on the main pad versus the top left and right corners. Without considering the turbo ability, can you play faster with that change?
Not limited to SNES, plenty of USB adapters that work with SNES controllers on PC.
Edit for image: https://imgur.com/a/KpNyf5p
I have the Windows 95 version where I can sell a Guard Tower or Advanced Guard Tower, hit S to stop it, get my credits back and keep the Minigunners. Easy to spam infinite. IGN cheat list says SAMs and Obelisks work for NOD.
Is this a "major glitch" that would need to be its own category or is this the version we should all be running? I see popular games like Donkey Kong Country where the most beneficially glitched version is the only one used.
Finally, would running on DOSBox be considered an official emulator? I have the C&C games bundle as well but Tiberian Dawn is very crash prone. Glitch also patched.
Can you recommend a good adapter to use my PS2 controller on PC? Idea is to practice on emulator where I can view memory and test for glitches.
I see 2 products on Amazon that come with 2x controller inputs for under $11. I just don't know anything about their reliability or polling lag.
Theoretical Strats
Doesn't belong in guides, being theoretical and all, so I'll post here. Hopefully can generate some excitement / interest into route improvements and interest in Ogre Battle in general.
Item drop versus weapon drop
With limited RNG manip ability, rigging one item probably prevents a weapon drop. Defeating the last of an enemy unit has a chance to drop a consumable item. ROM map grouping shows 32 possibilities. The Unit Analysis Guide by Deathlike2 says the item drop odds are 1 in 10, apparently not influenced by LUK. An early Dream Crown comes to mind, as does a Trade Ticket (TICKET).
Finally, a use for Death Tarot to speed up defeating a non-boss unit for the drop chance.
Trade Ticket Max Value
Using the ticket summons Anywhere Jack. He sells the HP, STR, AGI, INT and LUK boosting items. Very annoyingly, using the same item more than once targets the unit leader and leader swapping takes time. Even more annoyingly, using them gives a random boost and the game doesn't let you see it until you go to their stat screen, nor does it stop you from wasting on a 255/100 stat. Hey but if we get full RNG manip, we would know the boosts.
Can buy as many items as you want before exiting the virtual shop. Prices range between STR at 15k and LUCKY CHARM at 21k a pop. Late game I found 200k more than enough to max STR or INT along with LUK on a single character. You're probably aware that Tarot damage except for Sun is based on the Opinion Leader's STR or INT. We need money strats then.
Money Strats
Sell Moon Rose (Sharom District) for 100k in Organa, Star Fragment and Rainbow Shell (Fort Allamoot) each for 66400, Gnomish Nugget (Sharom) for 40k. I believe other valuable items/weapons are Reputation dependent but non-World can drop Brunhild after it's used for 175950.
I learned from @Dragondarch's safety strat that visiting Abdella in Sharom after the clear gives 30k goth if you have less than that - and can be repeated.
A Fireseal item run (sells for over 300k) or 100% unique items run might manip a ticket alongside a Euros. Fort Allamoot trade sequence, please.
Obviously, Sunshines can change the time to noon for instant city liberation money but on a speedrun with 0 to 1 cities liberated a stage, that hardly seems viable as an income source.
Fortune Tarot
Fortune is only fringe useful in a normal playthrough and it is here as well. Makes enemy unit fall back as if you won the battle. Preserves your unit's movement path. Can use to rectify a bad spot like in Brootus' run where he's trapped between two units, but also to push a bad RNGed enemy away to perhaps clear the stage sooner than by not using it.
Witch Mode
Here is the thing. Witch does no damage but if she stops two enemies from attacking, you gain on time if you couldn't win before those two characters would have attacked. Deathlike2's guide has the Stun and chance to recovery chances. Hit rate is INT-based, about 40% if Witch and enemy have same INT and LUK, and enemy recovery rate uses their STR. Seems hitting the enemy doesn't help them wake up. Another outlet for Trade Ticket stat boosting after the Opinion Leader.
Rashidi and Diablo CAN BE STUNNED. I admit I boosted my Witch's INT to 255 with Trade Ticket first.
Witches require 50+ CHA and 0-65 ALI. Phantom Lord starts with one so perhaps she's worth including over Lans. Debonair and Muses recruit Valkyries, who can demote into Amazon then promote into Witch. Rauny and Norn have the ALI to turn into Witches immediately. Deneb makes a great Witch Kappa.
Persuasion Spell [CHARM]
Obtainable as a drop from a defeated enemy unit and for a cool 50k from Musplem, Organa, City of Malano and Dragon's Haven, though obviously not worth the time in the latter stage.
The Spell removes all non-leader characters from an enemy unit and adds them to your pool of characters. Apparently can miss and uses Opinion Leader's CHA. Used presumably in casual playthroughs for Zombie Dragons, Dragon Tamers and evil units in Galf's stage, I never see it in a speedrun despite coming into Temple Shalina with well over 50k goth.
Is the issue that units you recruit or face in battle have about 1 less in each stat per level up than from you raising them yourself. Necessary to prevent abusing recruiting at towns with a less than full unit. However, I think the best use is for Any% to recruit high sky Wyrm/Wyvern, which has better stats and has faster attack animation than Griffon, in Diaspola, Valley of Kastro and Ruined City. Other chances late game. More fringe use to recruit Sylphs from Rhyan Sea and Fogel and Galf's stages.
Sylph (Sylyph?) Abuse
Fairies and Pixies are the worst units in the game and recruited units have about 1 less stat point per level than having raised them yourself. That said, Sylphs have sky high AGI to go first in battle with a hit all white magic attack. Tristan Ianuki then retreat abuse is a thing but using three back row Slyphs have the same potential.
Thing is, the Fae and Imp lines, among other non-humans, lack a CHA requirement to level up. This means a level a level 22 Princess or Seraphim can recruit infinite level 20 Sylphs. Note that one Dream Crown is given at city closest to Temple Shalina and another after clearing Musplem at Chilfa. Again, Persuasion Spell potential at Rhyan Sea and Fogel and Galf's stages.
Promotion
You already have to go back to City of Malano for the Zodiac Stone. Revisit Mon Bizoh and say "Yes" for a Promotion that grants a free level up! Obvious target is the Opinion Leader to increase Tarot card damage and boost odds of surviving Quake. Other choices are Tristan to increase Ianuki damage or Yushis, who at level 22 can recruit infinite Slyphs. Princess Aisha/Norn can too.
Reputation Dumping
In the speedrunning scene, Borgnine is the most famous man in the world. Infinite Reputation drops for Deneb and Galf and an Undead Staff for Saradin for good measure. An any% World would probably grab the Staff from Omicron's base.
I wish I had played through to confirm this, but apparently you can deny Rauny and Yushis joining the rebelling repeatedly to lower Repuation exactly like Borgnine. I intent to do a 100% playthrough looking for all Reputation manip chances.
Sirius in Werewolf Form
The tool-assisted Any% World run is worth watching. Called "tas オウガバトル" on YouTube. Near-perfect Joker pulls made me angry but if you want to greatly increase entertainment value and save a small amount of time (by using the best Tarots in the game) Fool + Judgement + Holy Lord's Banish kills Sirius in Werewolf form.
Glitches
As theoretical as it gets, @Krayzar did the first testing on corrupting memory while resetting during a save. Used in Chrono Trigger on a 1 frame window to duplicate items and our saves take longer.
The Japanese TAS from above does something screwy with input on choose a Tarot from Warren's deck. Unfortunately, I'm not sure what this does but perhaps the video text explains the trick. I presume uses an "illegal button input combination" (left+right or up+down on D pad at same time). Can also see a ridiculous glitch in the Diablo fight that transforms back into the Ares boss fight to fast kill.
On PSX, I used a Sunshine before Gares as is standard strategy. Diablo made the globe turn to midnight but the stage still appeared as noon. [url=https://imgur.com/sUNjBju]I then used another Sunshine.[/ur] Damage was still at midnight time but perhaps there is a way with Sunshine and/or Moonbeam and pulling Sun/Moon to force the game out of the midnight lock and crush Diablo.
PS2 Slim with Fast Disc Speed on left vs SNES on right. Playing off real game disc and cart. Recordings are my own. Sorry I'm not ambidextrous and recorded on 30 fps phone.
PSX looks much faster due to: a ) The X button (A on SNES) loading a whole block of text versus SNES having to scroll line by line. b ) Movement speed 3 on PSX is ludicrous. c ) ▢ button allows queuing up to 8 movements in a row on a single unit.
~10 second loss on PSX loading per stage not enough for SNES to catch up.
New Game Tarot Cards Castle of Warren
