Massachusetts, USAdiscussed in discord --- disadvantage greater than advantage but a perfect run on switch is 4:54.71 I mean obviously harder to get that run than beat Niftski's WR. Just a curiosity i had.
I'm totally fine with metroidmcfly having the better real time as it's the only thing we can determine for sure, but the VCR thing definitely exists as seen with SMB1 becausse the timing is made by using Bowser's patterns and knowing the exact frame counts that way. i
In-game time was the standard to which I did my run is the more important thing. Until someone beats me to the standard in which I did it I don't think you can technically say it's been beaten.
I am also not a mod and if I were I would possibly change it to IGT for ranking and not vice versa for this reason. Or once it was beaten I would revert it because real-time is the more accurate measure. That's to say, yes it makes more sense, but that's not what I was aiming for.
Another thing to note on that topic is that I am fairly sure I got a number of 6:01s and 6:02s in the process of getting this run. They could have been faster in real time, but that wasn't the goal! I was aiming for 6:00 flat or lower. Otherwise I would have tried to precisely time it this way.
https://speeddemosarchive.com/ProWrestling.html
https://www.twingalaxies.com/game/pro-wrestling/nintendo-entertainment-system
Was discussing on Excitebike how you can override inputs on the Switch. For example, you hold right on the joystick and press left on the dpad to override the right input.
Now I was thinking that this is also possible on oher Switch games including SMB1. After seeing people do TAS fast accels in NWC is occurred to me that... couldnt someone technically get a top time using this on Switch even with a technically lower framerate? I wondered if it would be enough to break WR even? I dont think so as I did note that there is a Switch entry in the top 50 but the difference between the times seems to be about 0.5 seconds. I could be wrong. Still, if this allowed for a perfect run more easily. After the time is converted the run would probably be close or possibly better than Niftski's time.
Anyway, I was having a similar discussion on Excitebike and realized this is a flaw in the way the Switch handles the inputs rather than simply just a different control set. Ifthis DOES result in a faster time I would imagine the smb1 community would disallow Switch. However, I'm not sure if it's enough to matter, but the advantage there does exist, but you're probably moe disadvantaged by the framerate at the end of the day. Still, I thought I'd mention it AND that this could also apply to all Switch re-releases.
The best settings should be used which I believe are also the default settings.
What's also funny is that if you apply the same lag issue from my SMB1 run to the Pro Wrestling run, then I think my time would be 10:02.47 if I'm calculating it right. That would mean our runs could be the exact equal length. The only difference being that my run's in-game time is 6:00, where his is 6:01.
Things can remain as is. I do realize in-game time is also listed and that I'm being a little weird.
I just like accuracy. That's why I'm here. The real problem is that my time is likely 10:02 and not 10:03, but it's impossible to prove it.
Feel free to ignore the rest of this. I'm bored, curious, and I like math so I calculated times based on what I understand about VCR lag.
A VCR records and replays at a lower FPS than an NES which is why this discrepancy exists and would exist for any VCR recording video games.
Normally a VCR records at 59.94FPS, but It's my understanding that a VCR can record at a maximum of 60FPS under normal conditions, but can record more if the VCR happens to be able (basically overclocking the VCR). The NES runs at 60.0988139FPS. The video then plays back at the standard 59.94FPS, so the minimum amount of lag when recording a video game with a VCR should be exactly 99.9% (59.94/60) of the actual game time.
So in the case of my Pro Wrestling run the minimum amount of lag would be: Time = 10:03.233 Time = 603.233 seconds 603.233*(59.94/60) = 10:02.629
The maximum amount of lag would result in: Time = 10:03.233 Time = 603.233 seconds 603.233*(59.94/60.0988139) = 10:01.638
Metroidmcfly's (former SRC) time is 10:02.467.
OK, so today it was brought to my attention that my old Super Mario Bros speedruns were timed incorrectly.
What does this have to do with Pro Wrestling? Well, the reason SMB1 was timed wrong was because it was done using a VCR. My Pro Wrestling was also done with a VCR.
As I've always suspected and as far as I'm aware VCR recordings add between 0.3-0.4 seconds per 5 minutes of recording. Pro Wrestling is about 10 minutes in real time so my actual time would be 10:02.
Why do I care? Well, Metroidmcfly had previously beaten my run in real time with a 10:02. The run is now removed, but taking into account the VCR issue the runs would be virtually identical in time. It can't be determined. The only reason SMB1 can be determined is because of Bowser's patterns, but with Pro Wrestling there isn't any way to know.
There's also the fact that the standard timing for this game was in-game time initially with Twin Galaxies and then with Speed Demos Archive.
My Pro Wrestling run also happens to be the oldest standing NES world record as far as I'm aware.
So I just have a lot to say about this even though it's a silly speedrun because technically my in-game time was never beaten and it's inconclusive whether it was ever beaten in real time either because of the VCR issue.
Conclusion is this: My time is definitely 10:02 and not 10:03 because of this issue. I feel like in-game time should be the standard until someone beats my time. I just wanted to mention all of this. You can do whatever you wish.
Another thing to consider is that possibly the opponent for 100M/110M would finish faster because it's a lower qualify time, but it's hard to say how that works.
This kind of thing just brings a lot of questions though probably not a big deal. I just feel like there could be time save/loss that isn't obvious. Just my 2 cents.
I think this would all be equal time-wise, though part of me thinks there could be a discrepancy somehow. Like does it being loop 2 after high jump effect anything time-wise? I wouldn't think so... maybe skeet shooting? Does the pattern there change? I can't recall.
If you were to start after skeet shooting then you would possibly have an advantage due to the pattern change.
it can save time over WR if you play the end perfectly basically. just happens to work out timing wise on veggie spawns... 2 frame window to hit it as well.
I submitted for the full game run. :) I am so bad at this game hahaha
The run probably is the slowest it possibly could be for this category (finished with 0 seconds). But hey! I completed a run. I wanna do A LOT better eventually.
Awesome thanks! Empty categories are annoying so I get that too.
My suggestions:
- Add a dropdown of "Arcade Version 1" for the original version.
- Create a "Full Race"" category with the same dropdowns.
- Sort the arcade runs to the appropriate categories whether version 1 or version 2.
It's easy to tell the difference between the versions because the qualifying lap score is always 10000 (and VERY rarely 10010) on the original, whereas the other version is always much more (10200+ generally).
I don't need to be a mod. I just suggested it since I've looked a bit into the versions and such + if it's a hassle for you.
TG is essentially obsolete these days. I feel like SRC should be the more important board for this simply because the scoring is RNG or flawed in some regard. That's to say, I basically wanna see Daniel at the top as he deserves for the full game category.
Here's the full game run I'm referring to:
Score is a seemingly random element in this game and so speed is actually the more skillful metric the way I see it.
Anyway, I was also hoping to submit a run for this myself at some point, but I just felt it would be nice to give the Pole Position champ his rightful spot on that category. Plus, the fact that there are version differences it'd be nice to see the original version tracked as well.
The way it's sorted now is tricky, but among the arcade versions they definitely differ a lot game to game. In general, the version with fastest times should take precedent, but I also think there should be runs for the original version as well.
Just to explain what I mean... 54.1 is simply not possible for the original arcade version including some of the remakes. The limit is closer to 54.6 on the original arcade version.
Hey, oddly same question sort of. So I've been following the arcade Pole Position world record holder for high scores and there's many things I've realized. One is that most versions of Pole Position are inaccurate emulation compared to the original... Only the GCN version and PS1 versions have accurate emulation. That said, the times posted are only for other versions are only comparable to those versions.
Secondly, there should be a full game category which completes the entire race.
Would it be possible to add the categories and possibly split the boards for better accuracy? I'd love to become a mod for this game if possible and sort this stuff out. I would simply be adding categories for the sake of completeness and accuracy of the title.
Thanks,
- AndrewG
