You guys are jerks.

...although joking aside, when categories like LMOE and a blatant cheat mod still exist, I could see why this was taken seriously. :)

What "exploit blocks" are there besides player clips and pushers? Console output would be quite easy to video-edit, so requiring a demo file would be safer, but I don't know if all the runners would want to go there.

I'm somewhat interested, because it might help with testing what's possible with good bhopping in the old version.

[quote=TheMaster]The purpose of speedrunning is...[/quote]What you personally feel about the "purpose of speedrunning" and what "is wrong" in your book doesn't say anything about how easy it is to cheat, which is my primary concern.

[quote]What is wrong with being a purist for the main category of the game?[/quote]There is nothing wrong if each rule can be verified.

[quote]I don't see any solution besides hoping for the best[/quote]How is "hope" a solution for anything?

[quote]Not allowing bunnyhopping even manually is even more impossible to police and still removes that skill from the game[/quote]How is that impossible when video proof is required? Just watch for momentum-preserving/building jumps as you're verifying the run. It doesn't matter if bhopping requires skill; sometimes there is a cost to keeping a speedrun fair.

[quote]Even if the script ¤is¤ exploited, considering how much somebody will have to conceal it, it will likely not make a large impact, certainly not to the degree allowing the script at all times would.[/quote]It was stated in the OP that it is easy to conceal, and nobody has contested that. If you reserve the script for the huge time savers as I've already mentioned, then it will have a large impact.

[quote]The way I see it, the leaderboards have been up for some time, [...] it's been working all this time and to let it go.[/quote]So I should keep my back door unlocked because nobody's tried to break in through it yet, right? "It hasn't bitten us in the ass yet" is not a good reason to do nothing about it.

[quote]disallowing bunnyhopping in general is the least of the evils presented[/quote]That is the next best solution I can think of, even if it would potentially invalidate many of the existing runs.

[quote=Canterlott]That's true, but for someone to go through that much effort just to cheat a run of a shit game nobody really cares about would be stupid. That doesn't mean it won't happen, obviously.[/quote] I doubt it would take that much effort since NohBoard is open-source.

[quote=Canterlott]How about just not bhopping at all if you're that worried about your run being denied?[/quote] My worry is exactly the reason for me posting here and hoping for a mod's response. I don't want to slow down my runs, and at the same time, it bothers me that the door is wide open for cheaters.

[quote=Canterlott]That's a bit redundant; that should go without saying. Cheaters have an unfair advantage in any situation, because they're cheaters.[/quote] I forgot to specify the part where cheaters can easily get away with it in this game.

[quote=Canterlott]I don't understand how disallowing scripts is unfair to people who don't script.[/quote] As I explained earlier, it's too easy for cheaters to get away with scripting.

[quote=Canterlott]How would you suggest this be changed, by disallowing bhopping entirely, rejecting all runs in which someone jumps twice in a row? Should we make another category for each category in which bhopping isn't allowed, further cluttering the category list? Bhopping is a fundamental exploit used in many games, which means it can be cheated/scripted in practically all of them, as well.[/quote] Those solutions suck, but they are at least better than making it easy to cheat. I currently can't remember any game where bhopping is disallowed, and since this game doesn't get much attention when it comes to speedrunning, I personally wouldn't want another category. Simply dropping the "no scripting" restriction, at least when it comes to bhopping, is the sanest solution I can think of, especially when a script is readily available here.

[quote=Canterlott]This is why all we can do is leave it up to the mods to decide, or just not bhop at all.[/quote] Before I make a decision on how I'm going to do future runs, it would be nice to have a mod's opinion on my concern.

[quote=Canterlott]You could always use a keyboard overlay such as NohBoard to show your jumps, although as I stated before, that won't 100% prove that a run isn't scripted.[/quote] I think an additional problem with NohBoard is because it's open-source, a developer could easily modify it so that it won't flash your spacebar again if the amount of the time that's passed since the previous press is low enough. This could lead to a video that looks legit until a bhop timing expert actually scrutinizes the jumps frame-by-frame; I don't think making that part of the verification process or requiring a keyboard overlay for every run is something that anybody wants to do.

[quote=Canterlott]As long as you're not getting flawless hops throughout the entire run, which due to the low tickrate would be near impossible without a script, mods should have no reason to deny your run.[/quote] So basically, like you've already stated earlier, cheaters have an unfair advantage as long as they only toggle on their bhop script at important places, e.g., c1m3 escalator, c2m1 slopes, c5m5 slope. A rule that disallows bhop scripts but not bhop itself doesn't seem fair to the people who've been doing it 100% manually so far.

[quote=Derpduck]There's nothing suspicious about those bhops at all, if anyone thinks they are then they are just bad.[/quote] Thanks, though that only sort of answers the less important of my two questions. I don't want a mod to question the legitimacy of my run if I ever get good at bh in this game.

How can you tell if the mods "do a pretty good job"? I'm curious about where the line would be drawn, because cheaters could select important parts of a run to enable a bhop script and chalk it up to luck.

For example, would the beginning of this video raise any eyebrows?

I've been bhopping since Quake, and have had to practice it in Quake 3 CPM, Warsow, and other Source games. I've only recently started trying it seriously in Left 4 Dead 2 over the past couple of weeks, so I don't know how good I'll become at it.

For most games, like Nasood stated, the GDQ committee does not want to have them run in two consecutive events. For what it's worth, due partly to the poor reception of the previous GDQ run, many people want the next one to be on at least Expert. The Master, I, and two others intend to submit a run for AGDQ 2017 together.