Simply put, the requirement is to do all 18 non-DLC story missions, starting from Armies of Ruin and ending on Liberation of the Triforce. The part about in order basically refers to not skipping around the mission select screen, like finishing the prologue missions then doing the Ganondorf missions next then going back to do the 'split timeline missions' ect ect, you can do the branch paths in whichever order you prefer though.

Speaking as someone who's done "Lana%" runs before, there's absolutely nothing stopping anyone from doing runs that don't have a leaderboard, although its unlikely any more will ever be added. The only real reason for "Agitha%" getting a leaderboard is basically because it was a community meme back in the day and a few of us actually did it for fun and laughs.

I've personally also wondered about the potential for Challenge Mode runs, at least Ganon-runs if nothing else, but like any other character runs I don't think it's likely to get a leaderboard for it. I know there was also some talk for a short time of a Cia's Tale category that never really went anywhere either.

In theory it should be possible assuming someone has a flash drive they can copy the file onto and upload it somewhere online, then you'd just need to do the opposite to get it on your console. But I don't know if Nintendo has some kind of anti-copy protection on the Wii U or not.

And in a similar vein, let's cover Mixer set-ups as well, starting by going over everyone's.

Flip: Rice Ball, to be switched to Book of Glory later Chili Shrimp Book of Duplication Book of Holy Water Book of Deduction Book of Fortune Book of Audacity Strahteme Horn

David: Basically I just drop the Rice Ball/Book of Glory strat Chili Shrimp Book of Duplication Book of Holy Water Book of Deduction Book of Fortune Book of Audacity Strahteme Horn

Etsuna: Strahteme Horn Book of Glory Book of Audacity Book of Maintenance Book of Wealth Book of Suppression Book of Duplication Book of Holy Water Book of Deduction Book of Exchanging Omelette

Much simpler than the Grade set-up, and just like it the best way to go depends on what fits your personal style the best, but my simple observation would tier them at.

Chili Shrimp/Omelette - EXP Boosting food Strahteme Horn - For the 5 required ones to advance the plot in Velanik Book of Duplication - To max out Strahteme Horns as quick as possible, minimizing mixer pop-ups Book of Holy Water - To help avoid encounters Book of Deduction - Auto-refill mixer, cutting out shop stops Book of Fortune - This+Grade Shop Mixer Upgrade=Best chance for Strahteme Horn creation Book of Audacity - Easy extra EXP, in the grey area of necessity

Book of Glory - Temporary invincibility, but eats up like 60 Eleth/second, safety strat mainly Book of Maintenance - Eleth regeneration, only really helpful in the final dungeon and you're using Book of Glory, otherwise there's never any real danger of running out Book of Wealth - Extra money, like some grade options, helpful if you don't have much Gald to inherit, but 1 million should be more than enough for a run easily. Book of Exchanging - Eleth regeneration, once again, only helpful if you're running a small capacity mixer or the Book of Glory

Book of Suppression - Eleth regeneration, but this one relies on striking all weaknesses of an enemy, which considering most of the run will be spamming 1 attack and killing in one-shot it's unlikely to ever activate.

Once again these are just my thoughts, opinions, and observations. Not intended to offend or sound dictatorial and as always open to discussion.

Now, let's talk Grade Shop set-ups and options. First up is listing out what everyone uses currently, staring with Flip's segemented 2:35 run on SDA, then what I have in my notes currently which were based on Flip's run, and also Etsuna's.

Flip: Inherit Titles (30) Inherit Skills (2500) Inherit Eleth Mixer (70) Inherit Gald (270) Inherit Stamps (30) Inherit Arte Usage (50) Inherit Books (10) Inherit Battle Items (60) Inherit Shards (90) Inherit Herb Bonuses (70) Double EXP (90) 5x EXP (400) Dualize Discount (100) Upgrade Eleth Mixer (50) Expand Inventory (100) Maximum Speed (50) CC +1 (30) CC +2 (250) Double Crit (30) Double Damage (30) 5x Damage (150) Double Gald (70) Unlock Qualities (50) Max Eleth +500 (100) Max HP +1000 (150) Skip Childhood (10) Inherit Carta Cards (200)

David: Inherit Skills (2500) Inherit Eleth Mixer (70) Inherit Gald (270) Inherit Stamps (30) Inherit Books (10) Inherit Battle Items (60) Inherit Shards (90) Inherit Herb Bonuses (70) Double EXP (90) 5x EXP (400) Dualize Discount (100) Upgrade Eleth Mixer (50) Expand Inventory (100) Maximum Speed (50) CC +1 (30) CC +2 (250) Double Crit (30) Double Damage (30) 5x Damage (150) Double Gald (70) Unlock Qualities (50) Max HP +1000 (150) Skip Childhood (10)

Etsuna: Inherit Skills (2500) Inherit Eleth Mixer (70) Inherit Gald (270) Inherit Stamps (30) Inherit Books (10) Inherit Herb Bonuses (70) Double EXP (90) 5x EXP (400) Double Item Drops (120) Upgrade Eleth Mixer (50) Maximum Speed (50) CC +1 (30) Double Damage (30) 5x Damage (150) Skip Childhood (10)

Now with all those listed out we can go through and split them into 3 categories, useless, mandatory, and help but not necessary.

Useless: Inherit Titles - Inherit Skills covers this already Double Item Drops - Unnecessary Dualize Discount - Should only be dualizing once, twice at absolute maximum Expand Inventory - Unnecessary Double Gald - Should have more then enough money inherited Max Eleth +500 - Should already have Max Eleth but can be very helpful if you don't Inherit Carta Cards - Absolutely Unnecessary

Helpful but not necessary: Inherit Arte Usage - Only really useful for increased power of Accel Finishers Inherit Battle Items - Very helpful for revives/hourglasses, but ideally you won't need them Inherit Shards - Needed for Genisimile strats, can possibly be helpful for Rare Sword starts though CC+ 1 - Helpful for endgame but not required CC +2 - Helpful for endgame but not required Unlock Qualities - Only really useful for Genisimile strat Max HP +1000 - Helpful if you take a hit, but not required

Mandatory: Inherit Skills Inherit Eleth Mixer Inherit Gald Inherit Stamps Inherit Books Inherit Herb Bonuses Double EXP 5x EXP Upgrade Eleth Mixer Maximum Speed Double Crit Double Damage 5x Damage Skip Childhood

I'd go over the reasons for the Mandatory column but they all boil either increasing damage dealt, gathering mandatory items, boosting movement speed, and just plain skipping chapter 1. So final Grade Shop selection should look something like this, combining the Useful and Mandatory lists.

Inherit Skills Inherit Eleth Mixer Inherit Gald Inherit Stamps Inherit Arte Usage Inherit Books Inherit Battle Items Inherit Shards Inherit Herb Bonuses Double EXP 5x EXP Upgrade Eleth Mixer Maximum Speed CC+ 1 CC +2 Double Crit Double Damage 5x Damage Unlock Qualitites Max HP +1000 Skip Childhood

Let me know if you think I missed something or messed up something or you just don't like the logic I used. :P

Awesome, another reason to work on the other difficulties. :D

But speaking of categories, I mentioned this in the other topic but does New Game Plus really need a separate category for Glitchless? Especially since all the current runs are already glitchless as far as I know and are in the 'main' category anyway.

Next, some miscellaneous things. Starting with some basic damage values, best text mashing strats, and number of required encounters.

Damage Test: (Done on Normal difficulty against Nova Wolf with all skills inherited, Enlightened Swordsman as the equipped title, and no herb bonuses. The numbers are also as accurate as I could make out but might not be 100% exact.)

Hubert: Long Sword w/Genisimile - 21942 Rare Sword - 16261

Pascal: Emission Line - 1960 Freezing Bloom - 2610 Nighthawk Talon - 4420 Celestial Eight - 108588

Text Skip Mashing test: (Done using the lady in Barona Inn who teaches you about Holding O to speed up text.) X Mash - 11.46 O Mash - 11.36 and for fun, X Mash with O Hold - 9.58

Mandatory Number of Encounters: 43

Looking at the numbers it's pretty obvious that it isn't worth going Pascal unless you plan to use insta-cast Celestial Eight which, considering the glitch can be a little finicky might lose a slight amount of time until you get to the point where you wouldn't be one-shoting things with Hubert anyway. That does bring up the question of how viable Genisimile Rare Sword would be, considering you'd need at least two dualiziations to get to it which means an extra stop at a shop somewhere at some point.

Mashing wise O seems slightly faster than X, although my timing wasn't the best so if someone else wants to give it a shot go right ahead. Holding O plus X-mash clearly trumped both of them though, although it'd be a bit more difficult to actually pull off during a run, not to mention most of the time you're only mashing away 1-2 text boxes for the most part.

But like I said, if anyone wants to double-check any of my findings, either the damage numbers, mash times, or even the number of encounters feel free to do so, you'll probably be more accurate then I am. ^^;

I'd like to start this off with a preface, this isn't going to be about telling you which character is the best to use, at least not right at the start. What I'd like to do here is go over the pro's and con's of each character as looked at from a NG+ run perspective, or more specifically the pluses and minuses of each characters skill set's, mainly their ranged attacks and their Accel's, since technically you'll always be playing as Asbel, just using the Narikiri/Roleplay titles to change his costume to another character if you want to use them instead. So without further ado, let's start with the basics that will more or less apply to every character.

Equipment: Now for the most part equipment doesn't play a super-big role in the run, you grab the Rare Sword from the Turtlez in Orlen Woods and your basically good to go, although slapping a shard on it for the Tempered Damage Bonus is a possibility, assuming the time trade off for the dualizing is made up for later on. Title-wise if you aren't using a Nova Arte you'll want Enlightened Swordsman to break Nova Barriers. Other than that Mixer set-up will likely be the same across the board for all characters and upgrading your accessory is unlikely to provide enough of a benefit to go out of the way for IMO, so now it's time to actually talk character observations.

Asbel: Starting with out main Protagonist himself, Disco Swordsman! Now Asbel, while being a primarily a close-range fighter, does have some ranged B-artes which gives him some options when it comes to ending fights quickly, although being Asbel's B-artes they all do require him to draw his sword to be used. Demon Fang, a 2CC, short/mid-range grounded projectile that can be fired twice in quick succession, Incineration Wave, a 5CC long range grounded projectile with a much taller strike that can also be shot off twice in a row, but slower, Shattersteel Swarm, another 5CC mid range attack who's second strike can appear anywhere, and Aurora Lotus, a 6CC teleportation attack that has no secondary follow up since it auto-sheathes Asbel's sword but is his most powerful B-arte. There's also the option of his A-arte chain, since his 4CC Neutral Burial Blade can hit anywhere, although that's probably best for multi-enemy fights if used at all. Now just looking at B-artes, I'd rule out Demon Fang for lack of range and power although that only really becomes a problem later in the run, and Shattersteel Swarm for lack of range on the first strike and both also lack Nova attribute. Now that leaves Incineration Wave, which has a wind-up and cool down although will cover most of a battlefield, and Aurora Lotus, whose teleportation means not having to dash in and leaves you with a sheathed sword which allows you to combo into A-artes if Aurora doesn't kill on its own. Looking at it, I'd give my personal nod to Aurora Lotus, although both choices would probably do equally well Aurora would probably win early game for quicker kills while Wave has to wind up, both artes however, are Nova artes meaning no need to use your Title Equip on Enlightened Swordsman to break barriers. Accel-wise Asbel's is offensive, although it's close-range so it won't be helping you avoid using time to close in.

Sophie: There's much less to talk about with Sophie, as she's even more close-ranged then Asbel. Her best choice is basically Shotstaff Blast and even then it might need a front step to get in range although it does have a small wind up which might give an enemy time to move into range. Accel-wise it basically gives her a much farther dash which could help closing in at the start of a battle, but you won't have many uses of it over a run anyway.

Hubert: Now we come to one of the characters considered best for this run, as seen by Hubert's use in the Segmented run currently up on SDA. Flare Shot was the arte of choice for that run and it's fairly clear why, as the most consistent ranged shot he has as well as having a better altered chain than Covering Fire, Flare Shots biggest drawback is lacking a Nova attribute, although it does Alter in Scarlet Salvo but only after Aqua Bullet. Another advantage to Hubert is the Genisimile skill, which doubles Flare Shot's power. Genisimile can't be dualized onto a Rare Sword in one go, but it can be dualized onto your starting Long Sword immediately. I do pan on testing out which is stronger between the two soon. And lastly for Hubert, he has pretty much the most useful Accel for the run, being able to summon a rain of arrows directly on top of an enemy from anywhere on the battlefield.

Cheria: Cheria is...decent for the run when you look at her on paper. Mid-range knife throwing A-arte's will require a front-step to get in range, and her 2CC B-Arte Seraphic Bolt can be instant-cast and is a Nova attribute spell, although some enemies tend to dodge it I've found in normal playing at least. Her Accel is basically a free Hourglass, which is useful both for making time to try and instant-cast and allowing your party to go wild freely.

Malik: Malik is another character who looks like he'd be good for the run on paper, but not so much in practice. Like Cheria he has Mid-range A-artes and his three 2CC spells can be insta-casted, none of them have a Nova attribute though and also like Cheria I've found all his insta-castable spells have enemy-types that can dodge them easily. His Accel basically moves him to his current targeted enemy to unleash a flurry of kicks upon them.

Pascal: And here's the other contender for best character for the run from what I've heard. Pascal has the longest-ranged A-artes, although he 1CC is basically a wind-up for her actual shots she can hit much farther than Malik or Cheria. her only Nova attribute A-arte is a 4CC one though. When it comes to B-Arte's she has all three of her basic 3CC B-artes insta-castable, but the real winner is her Celestial Eight which, when insta-casted, turns into Rock Lance, but with all of Celestial Eight's properties, including it's damage multiplier which is higher then anything else aside from Mystic Artes. Pascal's Accel is completely defensive in nature, giving you an impenetrable barrier for as long as it lasts. While not innately helpful for quick battles it does give you a safe time to instant-cast without worrying about being staggered.

Richard: Last and most likely least when it comes to this run is Richard. There's not too much to say here, no ranged A-artes and his only Nova spells being extend cast-time ones, his only real saving grace is that he can insta-cast the 2CC Soul Reaper. His Accel decreases cast time while active and restores him half the CC a spell takes to cast.

Overall: Hubert and Pascal seem to come out as the best in my view, even taking the instant cast glitch out of consideration Pascal's range on her A-artes still lets her keep up since she'll need few to no front steps to ever get in attack range. When it comes to Hubert the difference between the Rare Sword or Genisimile is still something I plan to look into as well.

(AKA: A place for me to ramble on about NG+ things in case anyone ever actually wants to look into it.)

Considering how barren the Graces forum is I hope nobody minds me making a place to consolidate New Game + Info, Discussions, and/or Questions. I know it's a pretty basic route, more less just going from point A to point B and fighting boss C lather rinse and repeat, but I'd still like to put down my thoughts and observations from what time I've already put into the category as well as the from the time I'll be putting in going forward, just in case it might actually be of help to anyone. And the first place I'll start at is with one of the most important aspects of the run, Character Selection.

Yeah, it basically goes Death Quote-Fade to White-Battle Victory Screen-Fade to Black, and victory screen is only a second or two to mash through so it's close enough that it probably doesn't matter too much in the grand scheme of things. Might be something to come back to and discuss in-depth if Graces ever picks up some popularity though hahaha.

Alright, well that makes sense. I guess the main question then is which point is considered the 'finish point', although it's only a difference of a few seconds either way. personally I split on the fade out of the victory screen so I might go with that personally just to keep it uniform.

So after going over the start and end points of all the runs currently on the Leaderboard, it seems both NG and NG+ favor starting time after confirming the options (which also honestly makes the most sense to me personally), while for the ones that don't end on Final Save after skipping through the credits go for either ending on the killing blow for Lambda Angelus or ending on the fade-out from the Lambda Angelus victory screen.

Well that makes a little more sense, although I heard some just set it to auto-start disc so maybe that was a thing in the past, I dunno though I just don't understand the thought process behind doing either of those or anything like them, or maybe I'm just weird and it makes sense to normal people. Either way though I'm just hoping to maybe kickstart some talk about Graces in general so I thought it might be good to start here. I guess I could start with my own opinions on it if there's nothing official on it or anything.

Since there's no rules or anything currently set for any of the categories, I thought I'd just bring this up here. I know the Japanese leaderboards time from Power On to Final Save, but is there an official timing style to use for speedrun.com yet? And if not would anyone be open to discussing one for future use?

Since this is the only topic for Graces right now I'm just going to pose a random question I've been thinking about. Is it really necessary to have separate Leaderboards for NG+ Glitchless and Glitched? Not trying to be judgemental or anything, just genuinely curious. The only two Glitches I know of for Graces are the Accessory Glitch and the Instant-Cast Glitch. The Accessory one is, as far as I know, Japanese only and is mainly used for money purposes, which NG+ can just inherit Gald and Instant-Cast probably doesn't save all that much time since you're 1/Few-shotting everything anyways for the most part. So unlike New Game I just don't see glitches saving enough time significantly for there to really mandate separate categories. But maybe I'm just weird like that and it is significant enough and I just don't see it, I just hope no one's bothered by my attempt to breath life into discussing this game. :P

Well I found out the problem, for anyone else who's having a similar tough time, you need to have Radiant Dawn data on the SD card before you can download and copy the files that are uploaded here.

Basically what the title says, wanting to get back into running this game but can't get the 'new' files onto my SD card to move over to my system.

Wait, so New Game + Speedruns are supposed to be done on Normal Difficulty too? Dangit, I've been doing it wrong this whole time! >.<