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United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

From further testing, it is clear that this trick is not dependent on having frame rate locked at <45 fps. It is possible to do this trick simply if your frame rate (upon triggering the alien by running through the doorway) is below that threshold.

I was able to artificially lower my fps within the confines of the game (i.e. without using any third party program) by setting up a custom game resolution of 3840x2400, or double the horizontal and vertical resolution of my monitor, in ENGINE_SETTINGS.XML, which is located in \steamapps\common\Alien Isolation\DATA. Custom resolutions are set under the setting named "Windowed Resolution" and follow the format of the automatically configured resolutions that appear when you install the game.

E.g., for mine it is: <Quality name="3840x2400" resolutionX="3840" resolutionY="2400" precedence="18"/>

(Custom resolutions that exceed the resolution of the monitor are only available if the game video is set to "Windowed" - they will not work if the game is set to "Windowed Fullscreen.")

We can discuss whether this should be permissible. It doesn't require a third party program, but does require editing a configuration file (which we've already allowed vis-a-vis double binding the mousewheel for "use" inputs). Not passing judgment one way or another here - just FYI for everyone.

revas01 les gusta esto
United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

@qckdth, this additional analysis has been added to the spreadsheet ( https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/15rj1pZy3QcVqHCGQe9I1TszpUwIwxOmZAreWd5VL3sQ/edit?usp=sharing ), below the existing analysis.

The goal of this additional analysis was to determine how accurate "frame counting" is in comparison to the game time determined by livesplit with the load remover. Many thanks to Metzix for providing a VOD run with the load remover (for 29 of 32 loads, up to and including the M16-M17 load).

Based on this, it appears that for each load, the load remover keeps the timer paused for an average of .3 seconds after the load icon disappears, or approximately 10 seconds total over the course of a full, deathless run.

For certain missions, the game timer remains paused for up to 14 frames (~half a second) after the load icon disappears (usually 6-8 frames, or ~.23s) and it was clear from frame-by-frame analysis of the provided VOD that actual gameplay for the mission had begun while the game timer remained paused (i.e. the screen had already partially faded in and Amanda had moved from her initial load position by player input).

Based on this, I believe that manual frame-by-frame analysis of the presence of the load icon is technically more accurate than the load remover in terms of representing actual load times.

Thus, I would propose that the manual re-timing of Bobbe's run be 2:38:24.5 and the manual re-timing of Metzix' run be 2:39:01.5. (Apologies for initially omitting from both runs the intramission load for the M4 elevator to the Systech Lobby, they have been updated to include this.)

Since these runs have been manually re-timed, we might as well be as accurate as possible. For consistency with the tool, an additional 10 seconds could be removed from both of these re-times, if desired.

Going forward with the tool, having an additional 10 seconds of time removed (compared to a manual frame-by-frame analysis) from a deathless any% run as "load time" is fairly negligible and should be the same for every runner who uses the tool. The "time save" effect would compound with more loads (i.e. from deaths), but there is no additional benefit where, as here, the best runs will necessarily be deathless.

Manual frame-by-frame analysis is extremely burdensome (it took me at least 10 hours to do this for three runs) and it is unlikely we (or at least, I) will ever do it again for a PC run. The tool is accurate enough (and most importantly, should be fair to everyone).

Many, many thanks to Fatalis for taking the time to put this together - the playing field is much more level with this available.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

Here is a spreadsheet of the mission by mission load breakdown of the top 2 runs.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/15rj1pZy3QcVqHCGQe9I1TszpUwIwxOmZAreWd5VL3sQ/edit?usp=sharing

Both the video time (VODs were exported from youtube by videograbby) and livesplit time (as indicated on the runner's video) have been analyzed. Very little difference between the two time metrics exist - 1-2 hundreds of a second on certain loads (due to the fact that "30 fps" in video encoding is not exactly fixed - it can be 29.xx or 30.xx).

Both of the runs have been analyzed exactly the same. The exact frame that the load icon appears is considered the "start" of a load, and the exact frame after the load icon is no longer visible is considered the "end" of a load. Every mission and intramission load in the any% run has been captured.

For the sake of consistency with the tool, an additional column reflecting "load removal as analyzed by the load remover" (+.2s) has been added. Based on the description of the tool, it seems that the timer remains paused for an additional .2 seconds after the load icon disappears. (See below for clarification.)

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

It will trigger when you return to the room to re-activate the generator.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

For the sake of testing (M1-M2 only), I used Shotcut with single frame advance to determine the values below (from Metzix' WR), with screenshots for clarity. For a mission with only one transitional load, four screenshots are included, showing the exact frame that the load icon appeared and disappeared, as well as the frame immediately preceding both of those events. Let me know if you all think this is sufficient in terms of (1) precision and (2) proof of concept.

[Legend] VT = Video Time (hh:mm:ss:frame) LS = LiveSplit time LR = Load Remover time addon (additional 6 frames or 0.20 seconds timer remains paused after load icon is no longer visible)

Begin time is based on the first frame that the load icon is visible End time is based on the first frame after the load icon is no longer visible

[M1-M2] Begin VT: 00:03:52:15 LS: 3:30.03

End VT: 00:04:02:24 LS: 3:40.34

Duration VT: 10.30 seconds (9 frames at 30 frames per second = .30 seconds) LS: 10.31 seconds

LR: 10.50 (VT + .20 seconds) or 10.51 seconds (LS + .20 seconds)

Screenshots: http://imgur.com/a/37xAw

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

It's not clear how imprecise it would be if we counted individual frames (although it is a giant amount of work).

Not sure what the solution is here. As QD said, it kind of defeats the purpose of having a load remover if we require a new WR to be one based on RTA timing.

Also any discrepancy would apply equally to both runs and be frame accurate, so regardless of whether it is as "perfect" as a program reading memory variable changes, it will be a heck of a lot closer to reality.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

If we're going to manually re-time, it will probably only be the top 2 runs because of the time it will take to count out the exact frames from each mission load. Additionally, psycho's load icon is obstructed by his webcam.

For the sake of consistency with the tool, we would be adding 0.2 seconds of "load time" to the frame after the load icon disappears?

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

If the top 3 runners agree to have their runs obsoleted by such runs (with longer RTA times, but shorter times without loads), that is up to them.

The point of the WR is to show the fastest gameplay. If someone has a 3-5 minute advantage simply because they aren't counting load times, that isn't necessarily the fastest gameplay.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

In general, we're not going to manually time out loads from existing or new runs (EDIT: but see below, we probably will for the current top 2 runs). It's simply too much work.

If runners want load times removed for new runs, they should use the load remover tool and submit BOTH times (RTA time + time without loads). If the tool isn't used, only the RTA time will be accepted.

It is in everyone's best interest to only do runs with the tool going forward, because (1) it makes hardware differences largely irrelevant (yes, there will still be some delays with certain doors that are faster/slower depending on another portion of a mission being loaded), and (2) at some point in the future, the default leaderboard will be times without loads.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

For some of the existing runs (particularly those where the runner had a webcam active and covering the loading icon area), it will not be possible to accurately time out loads using any means.

For others, there would necessarily be substantial difficulty with manually timing out loads (because we would need to perform a frame-by-frame analysis of the duration each load icon of each mission of a particular run was present).

Going forward, we think the best solution is to maintain two sets of runs (those timed with loads, and those timed with the load remover). The reason for this is simple: it would be unfair to obsolete a better run (timed with loads), particularly the WR, with a run that is "shorter" merely by virtue of having its load times removed.

Anyone can "sort" the leaderboard as preferred. See: http://i.imgur.com/36MMzQ3.jpg

Runs timed with loads will be the default means of sorting the leaderboard until we're confident that the load remover is functioning correctly (it looks very promising so far, but we only have a couple runs that have actually used it) and there is a larger collection of runs timed with it.

Metzix y qckdth les gusta esto
United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

Agree with these points. Third party programs shouldn't be allowed for runs because it's a slippery slope. There might be a rare exception for a game that requires an external program to run properly, but this doesn't seem like one of those cases.

If there was an already existing, in-game setting that could be changed (such that the game could be saved, closed and restarted at 30 or 40 fps while the timer stayed running), it might be a closer call.

That said, we shouldn't give up all hope. There might be a way to do it within the confines of the game, even on PC.

qckdth, revas01, y Metzix les gusta esto
United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

It isn't clear whether locked FPS is necessary, or whether "low enough" FPS would also work. PackSciences demonstrated a number of clipping glitches last year that seemed to be based on low (but not necessarily locked) FPS, so it's worth testing. Note that locked/low FPS might break other aspects of the PC run, such as ability to quickly activate generators with mousewheel inputs.

It might be possible to artificially limit FPS by having a ton of particle effects in the room before you run in (smoke bombs/flares?), because while the game is optimized, there are certainly aspects that chew up frame rate very quickly. For example, if you repeatedly hit an android near a wall, the "android blood" significantly reduces FPS, at least for me (GTX 760). This is really going to be hardware dependent.

From additional testing, it appears possible to do the door clip at 40 FPS (and potentially up to 45 FPS), so 30 FPS is not a firm requirement, although the difficulty scales with FPS. The higher the FPS, the faster the alien gets to the door and the harder it is to get ahead of it in time.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

This isn't PS4 exclusive, but it is framerate dependent (thanks to Bandaren for suggesting the idea of locking FPS at 30).

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

The alien beats me to the door as well but I'll play around with it. Super neat.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

Also we'd need to figure out how to time out loads for console runners. Perhaps by considering IGT?

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

EDIT: we're going to maintain two sets of runs. See posts below and on page 2.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

Awesome! We can now have a separate column for time with loads and time with loads removed.

EDIT: See posts below and on page 2.

United StatesInfomastr9 years ago

Oops, I did it again. :^)

Enjoy.

dcruze, chimpa, y Metzix les gusta esto
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