Wario's Woods US vs JP
2 years ago
Lower Saxony, Germany

Hey guys!

So i noticed by watching Doccano, who is playing on the japanese version, and especially by playing, that there are quite some big differences in the gameplay as some might already know.

The biggest (I think?!) are:

  • if you have bombs or enemies on top of you, you can't just press up to get on top of them, you gotta press a+b

  • sometimes bombs transform into enemies, which can be really punishing

I would say, that it is reasonable with these differences, to have a seperate leaderboard for the US and JP Version. I might give this version a try as well in the future. What do you guys think?

Italy

I wouldn't mind the idea honestly, I'm just not sure of how punishing those differences can be as I don't really get an accurate perception of it just by watching; guess I should give it a try as well. But yeah, let's see what people think.

Ontario, Canada

I just finished taking a look at one of Doccano's runs playing the JPN version of the game and did also notice many times that random bombs would transform into monsters, an element of RNG that is not present in the US version. I would say just on that difference alone that separate categories for the US/JPN versions could be made.

Canada

I personally don't think having to push A+B alone should warrant total category separation. Even if the input is different or in this case probably more precise, as long as the core mechanic remains the same then that's not a big enough change between versions.

I do think bombs transforming into enemies is pretty huge and should warrant separation, though.

Osaka, Japan

I'm a doccano playing the JPN version. The problem with the A+B controls is that it's a matter of getting used to them, so it's OK to assume they're not there.

The problem is that when there are three or more monsters in a row, the bombs in a straight line turn into monsters! There is an efficient way to place the bombs, which is only possible in the US version, so I think there is a difference. For example, when I put monsters together by placing another color on top of the bomb.

If I use it well with diamonds, I have the advantage of being able to use it to remove a single color, but I rarely use it.

Lower Saxony, Germany

After what Doccano said, I am 100% convinced, that we should have separated LB's. I think I am going to try the JP Version out in the future. The Bomb Transformation thing opens up to some interesting strategies.

Italy

Yeah, now that more Japanese runners have started posting to the leaderboard, I've actually started to notice how they tend to use different strategies than everyone else, so what Doccano says makes a lot of sense. I'd like to give this a few more days to see if there are other runners that want to chime in, otherwise we'll just proceed with this next week.

Italy

What do you guys think about putting the 20 Rounds and 50 Rounds categories under "miscellaneous" and leave the 99 Rounds categories at the forefront? Separating JPN from US means having 8 categories now and if we leave them all out it becomes a huge mess, so in my brain it makes more sense to grant more visibility to the categories that represent the equivalent of a "full game" category.

United States

You could just have a JP/US region variable and make it a sub-category (similar to what I did for ActRaiser 2) this way it doesn't clutter the page with all the categories at the top.

Washington, USA

I don't run this game, but I think that, instead of making entire new categories for the US/JP versions, maybe you could just have a variable that can apply to all categories and act as a subcategory, similar to how the SM64 board at https://www.speedrun.com/sm64 handles platforms/releases (for example).

It would make sense to have the 20R/50R categories be miscellaneous categories since, as you said, they don't go through the fullest amount of gameplay available in that mode. However, you can do one or both of these things and still have a reasonable board. Again, I'm just offering an "outside" perspective, but I hope it helps (:

Edit: hmm. Didn't realize someone already replied with basically the same answer

Edited by the author 2 years ago
Italy

Ah it's totally fine, all suggestions are more than welcome. And thanks, it's a good idea for sure, so I'll try to rearrange things that way and see how we like it.

Canada

I think BOSTON. :D

But yeah, having 99 in the front (or the main categories) I've always been a fan of/hardest/most competitive categories on SRC leaderboards instead of the easier ones being the most visible. I think at the very least, 50 could be kept in front (if not just 99) but 20 definitely should be put into miscellaneous.

Definitely ok with 50 getting put there, too.

Canada

Variables make it look really clean, just saw it. I like how this looks as-is. Not cluttered at all.

Italy

Don't want to digress here, but definitely looking forward to verify your sub 5 run in the 20 Rounds categories since it's the easier and the least competitive according to you, David. But yeah, I think it looks good enough for now, and if in the future new categories are added, we can put the "non-full-game" categories under misc.

junkyard_dave likes this
Lower Saxony, Germany

Looks perfect like it is imo. Thanks guys!

Ontario, Canada

I see USA and JPN times for 20 and 50 Rounds were merged back together. I assume that's because the runs are too short for version differences to be significant enough?

Italy

Nope, just me messing around with sub-categories yesterday and forgetting to set things back as they were, thanks for pointing that out.

FFRPro21 likes this
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