Subcategories have been added.
6 years ago

We have created subcategories for this game's leaderboards to differentiate between certain program versions of the game. They are labeled as "FDS", "NES" and "FC" (Family Computer or Famicom), analogous to the system on which the versions were originally released. Note that this is different than the hardware or emulation software on which the run was performed. For example, one could run the FDS version on NES or Famicom using a flash cart but the appropriate subcategory is still FDS. All times will be sorted into their appropriate subcategory.

FDS will include all versions based on the Famicom Disk System ROM, notable for Japanese language and thinner font. The most relevant re-release version is for Wii VC which has the fastest loading times. ACE runs work only on this version. when viewing the ACE category, click the FDS subcategory to view the runs.

NES will include all versions based on the English language NTSC release, including PRG0 and PRG1 NES versions. This is the most run version because it is the most ubiquitous among NA speedrunners. As such, it is the default version in the listings.

FC will include all versions based on the Japanese cartridge-based release from 1992 on Famicom. This version is noted for having Japanese language but maintaining the thicker font face for numbers and Roman alphabet. Where applicable, this is the fastest version. For reference purposes, exact text time differences are tabled: https://goo.gl/t89Txm

I intend to improve this list to detail where all versions belong, barring discovery of any further changes. For now there are other resources on the subject including: http://redcandle.us/The_Legend_of_Zelda/Version_Differences https://tcrf.net/The_Legend_of_Zelda/Console_Differences www.google.com _

Background:

While it's long been known that the original Famicom Disk System release has longer load times entering dungeons and doesn't have as much general lag due to FDS hardware differences, the NES and Famicom versions were thought to be the same in all but language text differences and the reverted Pol's Voice vulnerability to arrows (irrelevant to most speedruns). Thanks to some disassembly done separately by Fiskbit and Zzewt, more knowledge has come to light about the differences between the NES release and the later Famicom cart release. The first difference relevant to speedrunning was a very small bug fix to shopkeepers, who prior to the Famicom re-release would hold on to timer values generated by enemies on the previous screen which could cause the shopkeeper to spawn up to 4 seconds late, though just under 2 seconds was normal in speedruns. Subsequently, strategies were developed to reduce the time loss from this bug in the NES versions, but the Famicom version is simply faster and easier.

Fiskbit's disassembly has been a tremendous source of technical information, providing us with the cause of many unintended behaviors and general knowledge about certain routines that are particularly burdensome on the CPU, such as HUD updates and pushing on certain objects like Armos (and also why the routine that should prevent Armos duplication fails). He also discovered that the Famicom version has engine improvements to fix minor graphical glitches that happen when entering caves and when changing rooms during an "adjacent boss roar." In the case of cave and dungeon loads, the fix adds one frame to load times.

In the process of discovering this info, Fiskbit hypothesized the cause of graphical glitches long present with my EverDrive running certain MMC1 games were related to NMI handler which is the subject of an engine change from NES to Famicom ROMs. This was evidenced by the Famicom version not presenting the same graphical glitch as the NES versions on my EverDrive. While testing that, I noticed that under conditions that in my near 30 years of playing this game would be likely to cause lag, that in the Famicom version the weapon sprites in the HUD would flicker.

Given what Fiskbit told us about burdensome HUD updates and engine improvements, I began to suspect that the engine changes may be reducing the gameplay lag present in screens with a high number of sprites. Subsequent speedruns on the Famicom version resulted in some unexpectedly fast split times where text differences were not involved (gold split from Silver Arrow to Gannon by 2 seconds). Obviously, that alone is wholly unscientific.

So I resolved to put this theory to the test in FCEUX running side-by-side the NES and Famicom versions in a room known for heavy lag, the 5 Blue Darknuts and 4 turrets room in Level-8, dubbed the Blue Lagoon by LackAttack. Over approximately 60,000 frames mostly spent holding Up+Left while running an invincibility cheat, the NES produced 1890 frames of lag to the Famicom's 864. This test was only meant to be a precursor to an RNG perfect test that would spawn the room with exactly the same RNG for posterity. However, this test alone was enough to convince the lead moderator that there is a significant difference between the versions that we could never accurately calculate.

While running the fastest and best version of the game certainly has its appeal, the general feeling in the community is that an arms race for the fastest version is not fun and/or that most people would prefer to play the version they grew up with (you know, if they grew up in an NTSC region). This change will also provide the opportunity and space to list FDS videos of non-ACE runs and perhaps even put some Japanese videos on the board.

Edited by the author 6 years ago
JSR_, Rep2369 and 2 others like this
United States

Long story short: The FC version has the better cart, and the better engine, but it's detrimental to speedrunning to allow it to compete with the NES version.

And I am sad since I love my FC cart. I'm one of the few to use one. But I know full well we won't go on forever with benign neglect once people realize they can save substantial time using that version.

Edited by the author 6 years ago
Eunos, JSR_, and Rep2369 like this
Game stats
Followers
1,183
Runs
3,187
Players
456
Latest news
Game & Watch added to "Accepted Platforms"

With the release of the new Nintendo "Game & Watch" which includes an official emulation port of the NES and Famicom "The Legend of Zelda" these versions are allowed for speedrunning purposes, because as far as we can tell, they play exactly the same as the NES versions (subject to change if other d

2 years ago
Latest threads
Posted 3 months ago
7 replies
Posted 4 months ago
4 replies
Posted 1 year ago
2 replies