News Guides Resources Streams Forum Statistics Boosters
Siren Forum  /  New discoveries
(edited: )

I went to town on Siren using save states and cheats, just to discover some potential new ideas for improvement and to answer some previously unanswered questions I had. Here are some results of these tests...



New technique: Shout Gliding

If you keep shouting frame precisely while strafing or walking backwards, you keep accumulating glitchy speed like with regular Gliding. But this style of movement has some differences too.

As you may know, regular Gliding eventually hits a point after which your glitchy speed is reset. Shout Gliding will work even beyond this point, allowing you to stress walls with even more speed than a normal Glide.

Doing Shout Gliding for long enough against a wall will accumulate a strong negative force, enough to push your character a few meters to the opposite direction in some cases. I don't think something like this happens with regular Gliding against walls. But, while unique, it still hasn't helped breach any walls yet (even after over a hundred frame precise inputs with this movement tactic).

Unlike normal Gliding, Shout Gliding can be done while crouched too because shouting interrupts crouch-movement. You won't get much speed increase while crouched, though.

As another oddity I noticed, doing Shout Gliding while in a freefall makes your character fall down slower than usual, allowing you to move further through air.

Performing Shout Gliding is slower & harder than regular Gliding and makes the character speed increase slower too, so its use (even in a TAS) will probably be somewhat specialized, if any.


Tests with teleportation

Out of curiosity I messed with character coordinates with cheats to access normally inaccessible parts of levels. It took a while, but all levels are now listed and (mostly) verified.

To note, if your character ends up fully out of bounds at any time, they suddenly start falling upwards. The fall can still be interrupted if you move back in-bounds... In other words, in TAS conditions this mechanism could probably be used like a controlled tool for gaining height and moving around the levels freely. The biggest problem so far is getting fully out of bounds without cheats, though - no known way to do it.

Kyoya Day 1 - 02:00

Early Mission 2 ! If it was possible to get past the wooden barrier during Mission 1, you could reach the letter and pick it up. Doing this sends the player to Risa's Day 1 - 04:00 earlier than intended and the Link Navigator scenes are graphically glitched too. To note, completing Mission 2 before even completing Mission 1 leaves the original level as fully "unattempted" in Link Navigator, and you can't directly access it.

• All indoors areas lack collision at the moment and can't be explored. That's a general rule with this game: if something is permanently boarded off in some level, it just doesn't exist.

Kyoya Day 1 - 08:00

• No early Mission 2: Getting to the graves during Mission 1 just gives you the generic "mana cross" message and nothing else happens.

• Tried using the Church exit, but there's nothing there but an invisible wall.

Kyoya Day 2 - 01:00

Early Mission 2 ! You can watch the cutscene of the scythe being found even during Mission 1, if you could get inside the Cottage somehow. This sends you to Harumi's Day 1 - 15:00 with glitched Link Navigator graphics.

Kyoya Day 2 - 07:00

• No early Mission 2: The prompt to pick up the electric cabinet key doesn't exist during Mission 1.

Kyoya Day 2 - 20:00

Early Mission 2 ! If you could get the Sewer Opening Tool during Mission 1, it would be possible to enter sewers with Yoriko even during Mission 1, completing Mission 2.

• I also tested teleporting both Kyoya and Yoriko into the sewer, but the level doesn't end this way. The Sewer Opening Tool is necessary in any case.

Kyoya Day 3 - 23:00

• No early Mission 2?: I recall that you can't defeat Datatsushi with the Homunaragi during Mission 1. But I didn't test it on this playthrough.

Tamon Day 1 - 02:00

• No early Mission 2?: I recall that even if you quickly climb the Fire Tower during Mission 1, you don't get Mission 2 for some reason. But I didn't test it on this playthrough.

Tamon Day 1 - 20:00

• No early Mission 2?: I recall there was something preventing you from completing Mission 2 during Mission 1, but I didn't look into it during this playthrough.

Tamon Day 2 - 10:00

• No early Mission 2: To win Mission 2, you need the faded photograph of Akira Shimura. But Yoriko is unable to find this item in Akira Day 1 - 16:00 until you have beaten this level's Mission 1 already.

Tamon Day 2 - 18:00

Early Mission 2 ! The album already exists during Mission 1 and can be examined, if you can just reach it. This sends you to Kyoya Day 2 - 07:00 early.

Tamon Day 3 - 03:00

• No early Mission 2: There's nothing really preventing you from going to the Generator with Tamon during Mission 1 already, but there is no cutscene or anything else of importance happening there.

• As another note, if you teleport into the large room with snipers with Kyoya and try to run to the exit, this does nothing either during Mission 1. It does work during Mission 2, though.

Tamon Day 3 - 22:00

• No early Mission 2: going to Takeuchi residence during Mission 1 doesn't do anything.

Kei Day 1 - 05:00

• No early Mission 2: I could get on top of the shed during Mission 1, but nothing happens there (beyond the automatic camera angle change). I guess using the can is necessary to start the full sequence which completes Mission 2.

Kei Day 1 - 12:00

• No early Mission 2: If you go to the back room of the Shrine early, it's possible to pick up Tomoko's item even during Mission 1. However, possessing it while finishing the level doesn't seem to give you early Mission 2.

Kei Day 3 - 12:00

Early Mission 2 ! If you can somehow enter the well early, the explosives there can be examined even during Mission 1. This sends you to Tamon Day 3 - 22:00 early.

Key Day 3 - 16:00

• No early Mission 2: just like in Naoko's Day 1 - 19:00, even if you finish the level with all the Shibito dead during Mission 1, you still won't get Mission 2.

Shiro Day 1 - 07:00

• No early Mission 2: Entering cafeteria early and examining the table during Mission 1 just gives you a generic message about the table being messy.

Shiro Day 2 - 00:00

Early Mission 2 ! If you could get to the courtyard early, it's possible to push the statue and go to the Hospital basement even during Mission 1. This takes you to Kei Day 3 - 12:00 early.

• I entered the Hospital basement without opening the door with cheats just to look around. The objects in the room have collision, but nothing gives a message when examined. The tied up character (old Miyako?) is already there, but her graphics are a bit glitchy and her hands are empty. Trying to hit her with a weapon is the same as trying to hit a wall - the hit is simply deflected.

Akira Day 1 - 08:00

Early Mission 2 ! if you could clip past the locked gate, the alternative exit from the level works even during Mission 1. This sends you to Naoko's Day 1 - 19:00 early.

• The pickaxe can be found inside the shed even during Mission 1, but can't be reached because the shed's door is locked.

Akira Day 1 - 16:00

• No early Mission 2? I think that you can't get Mission 2 on your first play of this level even if you complete it under the required time limit.

Risa Day 1 - 04:00

• No early Mission 2: you need Trowel to complete Mission 2, and it doesn't exist during Mission 1.

• Just out of curiosity I went inside the abandoned house. To my disappointment, most of the insides of the house don't even exist at the moment. There's only two small pieces of corridor where the Shibito are banging on the wall. The enemies aren't programmed to notice Risa either.

Risa Day 1 - 22:00

• No early Mission 2: there's nothing to examine under the sheets during Mission 1.

• Most of the other side of the hospital doesn't exist during this level. Just a part of the corridor with the emergency alarm as well as the room where Shiro & Kei are hanging out.

• The room with Shiro & Kei has a floor, but none of the furniture has collision to it. If you go close to either Shiro or Kei, they swivel around to turn towards Risa, but otherwise do not react to her in any way. Killing either with the Umbrella results in a game over.

Harumi Day 2 - 15:00

Early Mission 2 ! If you could somehow pick up the Beaded Doll during Mission 1, you get a Mission 2 completion upon finishing the level. This doesn't send you to a new level directly, though - it just completes a loop.

Harumi Day 3 - 00:00

• No early Mission 2: I went to Central Crossroads early during Mission 1, but there was no trigger that would end the mission there.

Reiko Day 1 - 02:00

• No early Mission 2: unlocking the gymnasium door can be done during Mission 1, but it won't give you Mission 2.

• I tried what would happen if you left the gymnasium without watching the cutscenes where Eiji Nakoshi appears:

- If you skip both of the cutscenes, nothing in the level has changed after picking up the Crowbar. Harumi is still in the Faculty Room and cannot be given commands to. You can't finish the level like this - the game just gives you the message "Harumi's in danger!" as if you never found her.

- If you skip only the second of the two cutscenes, in that case you avoid spawning Eiji. Harumi has teleported somewhere, but you can't take her with you because she still can't be given commands to. So in both of these cases the level becomes unwinnable.

• I tried what would happen if you activated the gymnasium cutscenes without having seen the cutscene at the Faculty Room:

- when you activate the first gymnasium cutscene, the game hides Harumi to one of two locations like always. However, giving commands to her isn't disabled and if you ask her to "Come Here" she'll come running to you. There is no cutscene trigger at the Faculty Room any longer, so it cannot be activated out of order.

- You can't escape the school because you just get a message that says "Harumi's in danger!" even if she's right next to you and enemies are not alarmed, so the level is unwinnable.

• Trying to activate the gymnasium cutscenes in wrong order is not possible. The trigger for the second cutscene doesn't exist until you've seen the first one.

Reiko Day 1 - 23:00

• No early Mission 2: even if you have the candles with you, it's impossible to light all lanterns on your first play of this level. One of the lanterns (C) just says that it cannot be lit.

• I tried visiting both unused exits with cheats, but they only contain a dead end.

• The trigger that starts level finale at the north-west corner of the map already exists behind the invisible wall that blocks you if you don't have Harumi with you. If it could be reached early, it would be a sequence break because then you wouldn't have to take Harumi with you during the level. But for now, doing this is impossible, even with gliding.

Tomoko Day 1 - 17:00

• No early Mission 2: even if you complete Mission 1 very quickly, you won't get a Mission 2 completion.

Tomoko Day 2 - 06:00

• No early Mission 2: even if you complete Mission 1 without being seen, you won't get a Mission 2 completion.

Naoko Day 1 - 19:00

• No early Mission 2: even if you knock out all Shibito before leaving the level, it doesn't seem possible to complete Mission 2 early.

• I tried the inaccessible alternative exits out of curiosity, but they both yield nothing but a dead end.

Naoko Day 1 - 22:00

• No early Mission 2: if you picked up the library card from the Mines and if it was somehow possible to get inside the Library during Mission 1, the folklore book there can be examined early. But completing the level afterwards still won't give you Mission 2.

That's it for now...

Bonesaw577Bonesaw577 and Shiro_A_ReedShiro_A_Reed like this. 
(edited: )





新技: 叫び高速移動





もう一つ気づいた点として,落下中に叫び高速移動をするとキャラクターが通常よりゆっくり落ちていきます(訳注: そもそも,落下中に叫ぶと落下速度が遅くなるのは,高速移動に関係なく発生する現象です).これを利用して,叫び高速移動で空中を遠くまで移動することができます.







条件1飛ばし 初回プレイ時,木製の扉を突破することができれば,いきなり手紙のところに行って拾うことができます!これをクリアすると竹内波羅宿ではなく,恩田廃屋に進みます.このときリンクナビゲーターの表示もバグります(訳注: 具体的には,行き先のシナリオが表示されません).また参考までに,条件1達成前に条件2を達成すると,そのステージはリンクナビゲーター上で「未プレイ」のままとなるため,そのステージには直接行くことができません(訳注: おそらく,別のステージから自動コンティニューで進まないとプレイできないということだと思います).

• このステージの屋内は,当たり判定がまったくないので探索できません.このゲーム全体について言えることなのですが,ステージ中で一度も使われない部分には,何も作られていません.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 初回で竹内の墓に行っても,マナ字架についてのメッセージが普通に表示されるだけで,条件2達成とはなりません.

• 教会への道にも行ってみましたが,見えない壁があるほかには何もありません.


条件1飛ばし 離れにいきなり行くことができれば,ささかまを発見して条件2を達成することができます.クリアすると四方田廃屋に進みます.リンクナビゲーターの表示はやはりバグっています.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 初回プレイでは配電盤の鍵を拾うコマンドが出せません(訳注: おそらく鍵そのものが存在しないってことですよね?).


条件1飛ばし マンホールキーを初回プレイで拾えれば,そのまま依子とともにマンホールに入って条件2を達成することができます.

• ついでに,恭也と依子を直接マンホールにテレポートさせてみましたが,この場合はクリアできませんでした.条件2達成にはマンホールキーが必須のようです.


• 条件1飛ばし不可?: 初回プレイでは焔薙で堕辰子を倒すことはできなかったと記憶しています.今回試してはいませんが.


• 条件1飛ばし不可?: 初回プレイで素早く火の見櫓に登っても,何らかの理由で条件2達成とはならなかったと記憶しています.今回試してはいませんが.(訳注: 単に,火の見櫓に登っても校内放送のムービーが始まらないから条件2ができないんでしたっけ?)


• 条件1飛ばし不可?: 初回プレイでの条件2達成を阻む何かがあったと思うのですが,今回調べてはいません.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 条件2を達成するには「志村晃の古びた写真」が必要です.しかし,ここの条件1をクリアしない限り,志村波羅宿で依子が写真を拾うことはできません.


条件1飛ばし アルバムは初回プレイでもすでに置いてあり,行くことさえできれば調べることができます.クリアすると須田蛇ノ首谷にいきなり行くことができます.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 初回プレイで多聞先生が電源に到達するのを阻むものはありませんが,そこへ行ってもムービーも何も始まりません.

• 補足として,狙撃手がいる広い部屋に恭也をテレポートさせてそのまま出口へ行ったとしても,初回プレイでは何も起こりません.多聞先生が電源を落としている場合はそれでクリアできるのですが(訳注: 「条件2が出た後,条件1ルートで行った場合」は未検証だそうです).


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 竹内家へ初回プレイで行っても何もありません.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 初回プレイ時に倉庫の上に行くことはできましたが,行っても何も起こりません(カメラアングルが自動で切り替わっただけでした).条件2達成の手順として一斗缶が必須なのではないかと思います.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 神社の裏の部屋にいきなり行くことができれば,知子の手帳を初回プレイで拾うことができます.しかし,それを持ってクリアしても条件2達成とはならないようです.


条件1飛ばし 井戸にいきなり入ることができれば,初回プレイで爆薬を入手することができます.クリアすると竹内屍人の巣Bにいきなり行くことができます.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 美浜合石岳と同様に,初回プレイを屍人全滅状態でクリアしても,条件2達成とはなりません.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 初回プレイでいきなり食堂に行ってテーブルを調べても,テーブルが散らかっているというメッセージが普通に表示されるだけです(訳注: 石田は反応するのかどうか気になりますね).


条件1飛ばし 中庭にいきなり行くことができれば,初回プレイでも石像を押して地下実験室に行くことができます.クリアすると牧野波羅宿にいきなり行くことができます.

• チートを使って,ドアを開けずに地下実験室に入って中を調べてみました.室内の備品には当たり判定がありますが,どれを調べてもメッセージはありません.縛られた人物(先代美耶子?)はすでにそこにいますが,表示が若干バグっていて,さらに腕がありません.武器で先代美耶子を殴ってみた感触は壁と同じです(普通に攻撃が当たりません).


条件1飛ばし 鍵の掛かった門を突破できれば,初回プレイでもちゃんとそちらの出口からクリアすることができます.クリアするといきなり美浜合石岳に進みます.

• 初回プレイでもつるはしは管理小屋内にありますが,鍵がかかっているため拾うことはできません(訳注: ただし,拾うことさえできれば,その後はいつものように条件2達成できます).


• 条件1飛ばし不可?: 初回プレイで制限時間内にクリアしても条件2達成とはならないと思います.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 条件2達成にはシャベルが必要ですが,初回プレイ時には存在しません.

• 廃屋の中に入ってみましたが,残念なことにこのステージでは廃屋内のほとんどが作られていません.2人の釘打ち屍人がいるところのそれぞれに廊下の一部があるだけでした.また,この屍人たちは理沙に気づくようにプログラムされていないようです.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 初回プレイ時はシーツの下に何もありません.

• このステージでは第1病棟のほとんどが作られていません.警報機があるところの廊下と,宮田と牧野がいる部屋だけです.

• 宮田と牧野がいる部屋には床がありますが,置いてある備品には当たり判定がありません.宮田もしくは牧野の近くにいくと,理沙の方を向くように回転しますが,それ以外には何の反応もしません.宮田や牧野を傘で倒すとゲームオーバーになります.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 体育館の内鍵を開けることは初回プレイでもできますが,やっても条件2達成とはなりません.

• 名越が登場するときのムービーを見ずに体育館を出るとどうなるか試してみました.

- 両方のムービーを見ずに体育館を出ると,バールを拾ったときの状態から何も変わりません.春海は職員室にいてコマンドも出せません.このようにしてクリアすることはできません(春海なしで脱出しようとしたときのように「春海を置いては行けない.」のメッセージが出るだけです).

- 1つ目のムービーだけを見て体育館を出ると,この場合は名越を登場させずに済みます(訳注: 当然1つ上の方法のときも名越は登場していないと思います).春海はワープしていますが,コマンドが出せないので連れていくことができません.結局,どちらの場合もステージはクリアできなくなります(訳注: 体育館に戻ればまたクリアできるようになるのかは未検証ですが,たぶんできるそうです).

• 職員室のムービーを見る前に体育館のムービーを見るとどうなるかも検証してみました.

- 体育館の1つ目のムービーを見ると,春海はいつもの隠れ場所のどちらかにワープします.しかし,指示は普通に出せるので,「来い」すればこちらに向かって走ってきます.このとき職員室のムービーはもう再生されないようになっているので,いつもと違う順番でムービーを見ることはできません.

- 学校から脱出しようとしても「春海を置いては行けない.」のメッセージが出るだけです.春海がすぐ隣にいて,警戒している敵がいなくてもです.よって,この状態からクリアすることはできません.

• 体育館の2つのムービーを逆順で見ることは不可能です.2つ目のムービーは,1つ目のムービーを見た後でないと再生されないようになっています.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: ろうそくを持っていても,初回プレイではすべての灯籠に火を灯すことができません(灯籠Cを調べても火を灯せない旨のメッセージが出るだけです).

• 未使用の2つの出口にチートで行ってみましたが,行き止まりになっているだけです.

• 春海を連れてこないとステージ北西に見えない壁がありますが,その状態でも,最後のイベントを発生させる判定は壁の向こうに存在します.そこにいきなり行くことができれば春海を連れて歩くことなくクリアできるので,「シーケンスブレイク」となります(訳注: Sequence breakingは海外のゲーム用語で,本来達成すべきタイミングより早く達成することを指すようです).しかし今のところ,これを行うことは(高速移動を使っても)無理です.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 条件1を素早くクリアしても,条件2達成とはなりません.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 条件1をステルスでクリアしても,条件2とはなりません.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 屍人全滅状態でクリアしても,いきなり条件2を達成することはできないようです.

• 通常行けない出口を試してみましたが,行き止まりになっているだけです.


• 条件1飛ばし不可: 美浜合石岳で図書カードを拾っている状態で,もし初回プレイで図書室に入れれば,民話集をいきなり拾うことができます(訳注: ちゃんと「つまんなそ~」のムービーも流れるそうです).しかしその後クリアしても条件2達成とはなりません.


Bonesaw577Bonesaw577 likes this. 
(edited: )

Oh, I didn't know you would translate the post. Cool! Sorry for the general messiness of the original post - I've now fixed its formatting and writing a little. I've also added new info.

Shiro_A_ReedShiro_A_Reed likes this. 

I finished listing the various levels in the first post. Also, made a video of all the known (theoretical) early Mission 2:

Shiro_A_ReedShiro_A_Reed and Bonesaw577Bonesaw577 like this. 

These are actually some pretty incredible finds. Thank you so much for all of the effort put into finding these!
Now the only thing we need to do is find out, not necessarily how to clip out of bounds, but just enough to clip inside areas that are otherwise just temporarily blocked off in early missions. Is there any way to do that with the shout gliding technique? I read your post on shout gliding and would think that if you could fly up into the air that you could get over certain walls? I don't know if it's possible seeing as I haven't tried it myself, but it sounds possible.

Latest News
View all
No news
Recent Threads
View all
Thread Author
Which console and version is the fastest
Last post
[Deleted user]
0 replies
Category variables
Last post
[Deleted user]
1 replies
Using checkpoint abuse in runs
Last post
8 replies
SIREN Community Discord
Last post
0 replies
New discoveries
Last post
4 replies