Seriously, it looks a mess. All the individual cups and racks need to go in to the ILs board with different categories for speed (sub, super and hypersonic) with the full League and full game split with 3 categories in the same way as the ILs, and really, since most people will just run hypersonic have the slower speeds be misc categories unless multiple people run them. Then the leaderboards actually look ok instead of this mess it is now. It's like a spider was squashed, to be frank

EDIT: It's also barely readable on mobile

This retiming may take a little to be fully complete, Demolition is doing some and I'll help in a bit. So boards may be a bit inconsistent till things are sorted

This I never had a chance to check before now but, for ILs, you can now time from the restart button in the level itself, though to make the timing match that of those who start runs from th world map if this is done 10 seconds must be added to the end of level time

I'll add it to the IL boards when I can be bothered to :P

http://www.speedrun.com/Yoshis_Woolly_World/thread/aiuh4/1#3n079

It's not because I'm mad at him. I'm more annoyed at him talking about me behind my back than his opinion on this but that's irrelevant. This decision was made long before he got mad at me by multiple people and that is how it stays

I've already said, if you're that bothered, have more people seriously run it, optimise it more, and then there could be room for argument. Until then nothing has changed from when the decision was originally made other than complaints from people who don't actually run the game, and I explained a similar situation that occurred when that influenced opinions of people who actually ran the game who were far in the majority, we have the blank, untouched categories to show it

Orcastraw, one mod (which is me if I can guess who you're referring to) didn't decide things. It was based on stated opinions by actual runners and mods. It was completely discussed and decided and it's only continuing because you are making a fuss about it. It's decided. So there's no need to continue to go on about it like you are. Maybe there's an argument to be made if it had as many runners as something like Any% Classic, but for now nothing has changed so the discussion and decision will not change no matter how much you repeat your point

If this topic continues the way it has about 100% No Badges it will be locked, like the other topic was, as this is a finished discussion and already decided, and does not need to be brought up again

Ok then. Lets clarify a few things before finally explaining where the board will go.

The mods agree with the situation staying as is, with 100% No Badges as misc. Not running a category does not necessarily mean you lack knowledge in a category. I actually decided to try some of these levels mentioned with and without badges that were mentioned here and there really isn't that much difference. As for badges reducing skill, depending on how used they can increase difficulty as well, both in 100% and in Any% Classic. But regardless, this point on skill is not really relevant in deciding whether it is a misc category or not, as the reason of it being misc or not is more linked to other factors, in my personal opinion anyhow.

Demolition makes a very good point on the situation. The badges are not cheating, nor are they unintentional. They are an option. And whether that option is undertaken or not in a casual playthrough is irrelevant to whether they are intentional or not.

There could be a point if badges drastically effected things, in ways such as GTAV Any% where by repeatedly dying you can skip levels. That's also similar to this game's Any% but this is considered a main category since we feel it deserves the recognition as the quickest way to complete the game, regardless of the bullshit the category really is.

Being an easy mode is also irrelevant to whether it is a more relevant category or not, since difficulty should not decide whether a run is a main category or not.

When you mention new 100% runners, we have 100% runners in Demolition and Another Castle, and neither of them have problem with this category being misc. So when you mention runners as plural you should really refer to it as singular. Allowing badges by default also makes a lot of sense since the game has them as a mechanic. If it was a glitch there could be more room for debate, but as Demolition mentioned, that then goes to the argument of glitched v glitchless runs, but the point is it is not a glitch an therefore should be considered as something to be included and makes sense to be.

Overall, considering all that, there is not really a reason to change the board to have 100% No Badges as a main category, and this is the status quo and the opinion of everyone aside from you Orcastraw. Therefore, since it is of the majority opinion, the leaderboards will stay as it is, 100% No Badges will remain a misc category.

With no more discussion necessary as all sides have been clear on their respective points, there is not really a reason to keep this topic open, and therefore is now locked.

Misc categories are not exclusively those that are memes, they are ones that are not run often or runs deemed to be runs with minimal difference to the main category. 100% No Badges falls this way. The distinction with Any% Classic can be made not only due to the high number of runners but due to the fact that Any% Classic No Badges has a lot of differences to the run in comparison and there are a lot of route differences in comparison to the difference in 100% categories. Others agree with the idea of no badges being misc, which is how it will stay

Amiibo should be added to the description fair enough, but no reason to ban mellow mode for 100% so yeah

Well for a start imo the only bit that's difficult in the final boss without taking damage is the bit with the giant yarn as dodging the fire in the first phase is easy but that's beside the point.

I guess there can be a 100% no badges category but personally I disagree with it being anything but misc. It's a mechanic of the game used to go faster and you're literally banning said mechanic to create what would be a slower run. I have also spoke with Torco on this and he agreed with this sentiment. I guess I can see All Collectibles and All Levels being moved to misc but the problem the boards are having and the other mods agree is that we have too many categories it looks silly. We literally have more categories than runners and it's a bit ridiculous.

The thing then is it's hard to judge when timer starts for that, hard to accurately judge first movement (or whether waiting around then moving would count to get right cycles) or whether to start on clicking retry (which would also then require people to enter the level then pause and click retry) so this is the easiest to accurately time and manage so is therefore the best place for ILs

I think that star comes from just finishing the game

Well the enemy criteria is necessary for 100% as hitting each enemy with an egg adds it to the scrapbook theatre and if you pause the game in the main hub you can see the counter for the scrapbook theatre. Same is to be said for the music (see: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CSW8xLKWwAAT7oU.jpg:orig ) and as can be seen do add a star to your save file. Therefore this is a part of 100%. You don't have to listen to the songs, just by being in a level where the song plays (if you play every level you should get this) or hit every enemy with an egg (again, same) you should be able to get these

Don't worry, it is sorted now. We were unaware of the full conditions when the category was made as it was near the release and was not a category many considered running either. After discussions it was changed so that the 100% referred to here was renamed to All Collectibles and 100% as it is correctly defined is a new category as 100%

Going off of a few other threads it would be for the best to have a discussion on the way the categories are managed at the moment.

Currently there are 5 'main' categories:

Any% Classic (completing the main game without mellow mode); Any% Classic No Badges (As above but without badges); Any% (Gem grinding basically, but the quickest way to complete the game with mellow mode); 100% (Currently collecting All Flowers, Yarn and stamp gems in all levels); and another added recently of All Levels (completing all levels including S levels but not requiring all collectibles)

Now this is where I'd like to bring a discussion in to things so as to have a clear and more organised board with all the categories that people want. Personally one thing that has a bit of a sticking point in my book but I want to see what others think is the definition of 100%. Now, at the times when initial categories were made no one really had an interest in 100% due to perceived length and this led to no real care being put in to defining it, which should have been the case. The current definition for it doesn't include heart collection and therefore not requiring star rank on each level, and I'd been having a discussion about it with another runner, Torco, that this should be part of it, but we never came to a decision and also felt we had no authority without a wider discussion. However without even realising I had I changed it (which is bad to admit and I apologise) and it was a good thing marcomania pointed it out so it could be reverted. However, I am of the opinion this should be changed to require star ranks for 100%. To make the current 100% run relevant and I also think would be a good way to do it would be to have the current 100% be 100% No Star Ranks and a new category for 100% All Star Ranks.

There I think should possibly also be a drop down added like the multiple controller one to specify whether badges were used or not or whether you did it alone or with another person (though I would be more inclined to keep Co-op categories with multiple people there own thing), and this would cut down on the number of categories while still allowing current categories to be ran. But an open discussion to make things clear on how they should be done would likely be best. Comment here, then how things go forward can happen based on what is said.

It'll be added, but to make the leaderboards clean it'll be added in the misc section, we had a problem before where we had too many categories that no one ran on there and we had seperate boards for the number of controllers used (instead of the drop down we have now to merge) and it made the leaderboards look confusing and messy and a decision was made by all the runners at the time to not have that happen. But I'll get to adding it now

Personally speaking I'd consider using badges though, they add a lot of depth to the game and especially in 100% lead to some very interesting tech, but it's your choice, enjoy learning and running it!

This was something I'd been discussing while discussing the addition of the all levels category, nothing was decided on this though but I must have changed that bit without thinking while doing all this, removed now.

There's never been much discussion on 100% which I think it may be a good idea for all active runners to come together to do, since really it should be included to go to having a 'full' completion of all levels but at the same time and matches it to other games in the series such as Yoshi's Island it isn't really a collectible as such so I can see that argument. Maybe at some point we should all come together to decide this, and then whether another category should be made or whatever. Changed it for now though

There were a couple of reasons why they were listed as miscellaneous but the main reason is basically due to the fact that either no one or very few people would run it and that in comparison to a single player run unless it's Any% it will basically always be slower unless specific strats are found. The other, more important reason, though, was that it made the leaderboard look really messy. Same reason we have the controller dropdown instead of separate categories. They look messy and intimidating so less serious categories are kept there for a cleaner run.

I'd say run Co-Op though, would be fun to watch :)

Agreed, I'll change that now, tbh didn't think of that and that's probably better

If you took touchless out and had a touchless% you would change maybe 5 levels and not with enough intensity to warrant it's own thing. Having character specific categories isn't a bad idea but not necessary as no one would run them and it makes categories look messy and leaderboards look messy which puts off runners thinking about the game (as someone who has had to deal with things like this with Yoshi's Woolly World I know exactly how much of a problem this can be)

We did used to have a Mario% which was just Mario and no catsuits but after about a week no one bothered and it was never put on these leaderboards for that reason.

It's not that they're bad ideas but they're completely redundant and unnecessary and therefore very likely won't be added