Pistol Only
England

I have “tested” hardcore but I did all bosses with 1 attack coin and it was the same as standard (the coin eliminated the need to DA Manip effectively) though my test fell short at Nest 2 hunters where I gave up, though I did have plenty of ammo, just not plenty of patience.

Ammo on hardcore is pretty much the same as standard.

The problem I think you’ll have even grabbing the magnum in hardcore though is that your major stumbling block is going to be CT Nemmy which will take pretty much all of your ammo leaving you with almost nothing (one of my earlier videos is a fight vs CT Nemmy at like 8DA or something? And I go through a tonne of ammo and I hardly miss.) So I’m not seeing how you could beat CT Nemmy and still have enough ammo to beat the rest of the game even with the magnum on hardcore. I mean we’re talking about an ammo route that requires you to get ammo RNG from randomised boxes prior to you even fighting CT Nemmy, you then have to also basically never miss a single shot on CT Nemmy AND if that’s not enough it’s like a 10 minute long fight minimum.

Also I agree, I very much doubt anyone will be running handgun only on hardcore or inferno. Nightmare is probably possible due to how the DA scaling changes, but hardcore and inferno is definitely more of a challenge run than a speedrun.

With the addition of the Magnum changes post nemmy 2 completely. on hardcore you get 8 in the gun, 8 on pick ups and 10 gunpowder. Havent tested for sure, but if inferno is 2 mag bullets per 2 powders I would guess hardcore is 3. which would make 31 mag shots in total.

nightmare/Inferno you get even more drops. you get 8 in gun, 10 on pick ups and 14 gun powder. making 32 bullets in total.

The biggest issue with these runs would be both Carlos sections and Jills item management. And ofcourse the regular issues of difficulty.

England

Do hunters die in 1 shot to the magnum or 2?

I’m going to test this later, but it would help a lot if I knew how much ammo I will need, because I don’t want to be grabbing every single powder.

It takes 2 MAG shots on assisted with the attachment. So at least 2 on other difficulties. Fortunately the magnum pierces at least with the attachment anyways. So less shots if hunters/zombies are lined up.

Picking up the MAG on assisted is faster than not doing so. So without a doubt itll be faster on Standard.

England

It’s not a question of whether it’s faster, it’s a question of whether it is necessary.

If it is not necessary then I would prefer if it wasn’t included as I don’t consider it to be a handgun.

However there is the thought in me that if this makes Nest 2 Hunters easier on the runners then in shear terms of making the category more accessible because of this then I would be in favour of it. Because this is honestly one of the worst parts of the run, yet I can’t help but draw a comparison to knife only where they have to kill these hunters with a knife which is a lot tougher than having to use a pistol.

Is it required that it has to include all difficulties? Because the magnum pretty much goes out the window as a requirement on anything higher than standard and imo it would be better to only include assisted and standard as run categories.

I often get caught on a reload fighting against the hunters in nest 2. Which is really only a assisted no upgrade issue. Since standard has 2 guns with 33 shots at that point.

Use to be against the MAG in a handgun only run. Im also against ng+ and deaths to manipulate DA. Since MAG is a handgun technically and within the new game realm im personally fine with it. Using it removes both ng+ and needed deaths(deaths are fine. The need to die is the issue personally) for 2 (HC sort of) difficulties so im fine with it being in handgun only. Ive always seen things as new game or ng+. NG+ being Use whatever in shop outside of limiting weapons to handguns of course. At the same time Im not saying it has to be that way. Just a personal outlook.

Keeping all difficulties is fine as they can all be done with certain allowances. Will they be done? Thats yet to be seen.

Edited by the author 3 years ago
England

Maybe I'm just bad but Defend Jill kinda feels impossible, also CT Nemmy requires you to perfect dodge every hit. I'm gonna pick up from my autosave later, but just LUL, I have the feeling that when I finally get by it'll be because I never miss a single shot and it will take all my ammo.

Washington, USA

I haven't tried it yet, but I guess you can just dodge and shoot the generators till the hunters show up, then just clean up when the last one is dead. That might be what you have to do on hardcore.

England

I tried just waiting around, it seemed worse tbh but maybe I went about it in the wrong way. I looked back over what happened when I got to the 2nd hunter and I just got impatient I think... I think you're right when it comes to the first hunter but for the 2nd hunter I think you have to focus on zombies while kiting it around, because the zombies make beating the 2nd hunter far worse. On the attempt I got the closest to beating I had like 57 bullets left, with a half dead hunter but a room full of zombies.

England

Ok so I finished it off last night. I was going to highlight the vod but for some reason the video producer on twitch wasn’t working. I’ll try again later when I’m home from work but I do have some suggestions.

The infinite MUP must be legal at least for Carlos only, there is simply not enough ammo to complete this section comfortably imo, it’s still a hard section with the infinite so it by no means trivialises this section, but it definitely does largely raise the odds of you actually beating it. Unless someone can get to this section in hardcore and prove me wrong.

Edit: So my proposed changes would be to group Assisted/Standard together rule wise, no magnum, no shop items

Hardcore/Nightmare/Inferno: Infinite MUP is legal (there’s no need to limit this just to Carlos as that would just over complicate the rules and it gives the players free roam to use it as/when they require). All other shop items are illegal. Magnum is allowed.

Edited by the author 3 years ago

I would guess any allowances would/should be run wide. Its okay to allow things in hardcore or above. We are talking about speed after all, not challenge. I still say hardcore should be given the samurais edge beginning to end minimum. You still get the fun of routing ammo and added damage to make it less of a burden.

Issue for me is doing any run in single segment/deathless outside of assisted. Beating it is one thing, single segment is another.

England

here's the remainder, skipped to the attempt when i finally did it but I think it was important to show the before too to be fair and if case anyone was interested.

England

@Jadusable2 if you allow infinite MUP across all categories it allows for static rules for all cats while also negating the need for the magnum. After all it’s use is depending on what category your using since it’s most likely still slower to not get the upgrades in assisted/standard

Edited by the author 3 years ago
Washington, USA

Unlimited ammo isn't necessary on assisted/Standard, and Hardcore doesn't seem to need it with the samurai edge. The rules don't need to be static, its about being able to finish the run at this point. RE3R wasn't meant for handgun only, RE2R wasn't either, but at least it was doable with the base guns.

Should probably try to avoid NG+ by using NG items instead of using NG+ items to avoid NG. Just my opinion extended categories like handgun only or knife only should be ran NG not NG+ if possible.

Edited by the author 3 years ago
Washington, USA

What knifefun said. I set up rules that avoid using NG+ when possible. It sucks that its even needed, but the more difficult runs are not possible without help.

England

Then it’s infinite MUP on hardcore and above imo.

Nightmare is doable, it’s kinda cool with the magnum. Very hard tho, I got past nest 2 hunters only to die moments later. Haven’t continued that yet though

Washington, USA

Unless and overwhelming majority of people want the MUP on hardcore, I'm not going to pitch that idea to the other mods. I don't believe it needs to be in that category.

to be fair the unlimited mup would be my last choice when it comes to all handguns if they were all allowed. the only upside is the unlimited ammo. its the weakest out of all of them even unupgraded g19 is a better choice. like I would use the g19 until I ran out of ammo and grab the mup just before nemmy 2 fight probably. If ng+ items are allowed mup should be the first option to be allowed since its basically an unlimited g19 unupgraded. Where I would sit it in stats anyways. Wish I had SRT mainly to see how accurate that assumption is and to see how much DA it adds if any.( If it adds no DA then its really weak, weakest of all handguns.)

Edited by the author 3 years ago
Washington, USA

Alright, so here is the news on HG only. We are going to be making it a category and it will be added to the board. We are only going to be adding Assisted and Standard for now. Hardcore and above are going to be held off on till there is an interest in them. We believe that Assisted/Standard will be the main categories for HG only. I will revisit the use of the MUP on Hardcore when/if it is added to the category.

I will follow up with a post and probably an announcement in the Discord when the category is live.

Edited by the author 3 years ago
NixIssues, kniferun, and SpeedIdol like this