NG+ ALL LEVELS
4 years ago
Ontario, Canada

I think that most people won't really be too interested in a category like that. The levels don't really become much more interesting with the new powerups especially considering the large amount of vehicle levels in the game. Also considering most of the warp 6 levels aren't too interesting in 106% except Solar Bowler, they'll probably be even less interesting as any% playthroughs.

You can still play the game however you like even if there isn't a category for it. Don't have to submit everything to this website.

Edited by the author 4 years ago
BlitzPhoenix98, ViperUK and 3 others like this
United Kingdom

regardless if its a category people would be interested in or not, it would still be nice to have some where to post times too. I don't see why the category can't be made even if it is something maybe a few runners do. There is no harm in adding it imo. I'll be hopefully running this category at two big events in the UK with a speedrun marathon i work with called UKSM and we work with Insomnia and EGX. Hopefully i'd be able to draw some more people into trying to pick up Crash TWoC and doing either any%, 106% or NG+ AL. Not only is it a category for people to just have fun with and do a NG+ it also just gives a third option. Again i get the whole thing with mods on speedrun.com not wanting to add useless categories but if you have runners willing to do it then whats the harm?

Ontario, Canada

If a lot of people show interest in the category then perhaps that would be a legitimate reason to add it. For now though it appears to be only you. Also saying what's the harm isn't a great reason for why to add a category. If every person's category suggestion got added everywhere on this site then it would be a mess.

Keep in mind as well that the crash leaderboard mods have discussed trying to get a category extensions board for the crash series up and running at some point and honestly something like this would be more fitting there than on the main leaderboard.

Colorado, USA

Cool idea. What was your inspiration to decide on this? What is it about Any% that's off-putting to you?

United Kingdom

saying whats the harm isn't a good reason to add a category that is true, and yeah atm it is only me that is showing interest in running a category like this, but a NG+ AL is and would be diverse from an any% even if it is by 5 levels. If a NG+ AL had basically no change to an any% run then i would see it as going onto an extension / not being made, But seems as in any% you only get to go through 25 levels, the other 5 that are only done in a 106% run are quite fun to run with the exception of Ice station bandicoot, not everyone is up for doing a 2h 30min run of collection so having a NG+ AL category means they can just run all 30 levels + 5 bosses without having to do the 106 and get the extra stuff. The other reason why i added the AL instead of just saying NG+ of the Any% is to create that extra part of the run that changes it from an any% and 106% so having it on the main leader-boards imo would be fine. If how ever it was just a NG+ category for just an any% run then yes, i would understand putting it on an extension board.

United Kingdom

also nothing jumpyluff. I enjoy doing any% and 106% runs. I wanted to be able to play and run the FULL game but without the 106% aspect so a NG+ ALL LEVELS came to mind

England

I mean this in the nicest possible way, PLEASE don't submit NG+ anything to any sort of speedrunning. I'm not trying to be horrible, but Crash is already an embarrassment as a series when it comes to live events, and not only is this not a speedrun, but it would ruin the smidge of dignity that the Crash community has as a whole within speedrunning. In most games, an NG+ category is made from a glitch in the game where you can start the save file without having actually collected anything - and there are still things to collect. In this supposed category - there is nothing to collect; there's nothing to achieve. What's stopping you from going into Weathering Heights, getting 139 boxes and coming out of it like 'yeah lol I got all the boxes prove to me otherwise' because you don't get the gem. I'm not willing to sit through and watch this pile of garbage in my own runs so I'm willing to bet that no mod's gonna sit through and watch a full run of a non-category. This is speedrunning my friend, not build a category workshop.

BlitzPhoenix98, Cody and 6 others like this
England

Btw I have a 1:10 RTA in this category now, I didn't wanna go to the effort of doing a run but I'll be completely honest the thought of this being at a speedrunning event absolutely pains me. I appreciate what you're thinking behind this category but in practicality it just cannot exist as a speedrunning category. There's no objective, there's no goal, and, in theory, there's nothing stopping you from going into a level, pressing start, exiting the level, then classing that as an 'all levels run'

BlitzPhoenix98, Cody and 3 others like this
United Kingdom

i see and understand the points being made here. I would like to say that "...in theory, there's nothing stopping you from going into a level, pressing start, exiting the level, then classing that as an 'all levels run'" imo this is not an excuse, The whole point of a rules set is to determine what is and what is not allowed in the run and if someone was to do that then the run would not be accepted, simple as that. Point of ALL LEVELS is to race through all levels, i would think anyone who has a brain would understand the category and its rules and wouldn't just "press start, exiting the level, then classing that as an 'all levels run'" respectively, you saying there is no goal behind the category is false, The goal of any speed game period is to get it done as fast as possible in its respected category. I understand that The crash game series is a collection based speed game but again saying that there is no objective or goal i think is a poor excuse because there is:

  • Beat levels 1 - 30 + all bosses in the quickest time possible
  • Basically acting as a marathon of the time trial relic runs in the game already
  • plus the ability of the speed shoes may not be a huge goal or objective but there is one there. Now for example and taking your "No Objective or goal" further, what about a games like Super Monkey Ball Deluxe or Mable blast Ultra or any other time trial based speed game? I have been running games like Super Monkey Ball Deluxe for about 3 years and i also see you have done some runs of it yourself and of SMB2, but what is the "goal" or "Objective" to that game? its to beat the level as fast as possible. Which is what im trying to suggest here, a NG+ AL is just that, beat each level as fast as you can. I understand that its not a category for everyone and if anything would appeal to a very very small audience, but saying "...but in practicality it just cannot exist as a speedrunning category." imo is false. Granted this is just a matter of different opinions on the subject and of course my views are different to yours and anyone else's
United Kingdom

Most likely echoing what Tebt outlined here but the quality of a run isn't a deciding factor on whether it requires a leaderboard or not. For a leaderboard to exist there needs to be competition, or you might as well just keep a record of your own attempts. No one is stopping you running/submitting a game, but not everything needs to be made into a leaderboard.

Also TWoC already requires time from the mods to remove loads and make sure the run is valid, and for something like this it wouldn't be fair for them to have to validate additional categories that don't need to exist in the first place. Leaderboards don't just "exist" without people putting the time into maintaining them.

Orkney, Scotland

I think the main problem with this as a category is that as far as the game is concerned, you don't actually beat anything. Nothing during the run (aside from the final boss) has an impact on the game being beaten as all the crystals are already collected, meaning by default it's already quite arbitrary. And throwing in the extra warp levels doesn't add much to the run at all. You're starting the game in a beaten state so this category ends up being a string of ILs with little consequence for routing.

This is why Crash 3 NG+ is interesting, as you actually start a new game but with all the powerups as the result of the glitch. You still need to beat the game and actually collect the crystals. It introduces interesting routing as the levels still need to be unlocked. If there was a similar cheat code to WOMBAT that only did the powerups, this might give the category more validity.

I won't say that you don't have a goal there and that there isn't a set of rules that could facilitate the type of run you are wanting to do. The number one problem that stops this being considered as a category is that one of those goals can never be "beating the game" as the game is already in a beat state. If you take this category seriously and get a really good time, who knows it could be a really fun race category. I could definitely see this being hosted on some sort of category extension board, but for the reasons stated above, to keep it in line with every other crash game a run that doesn't beat the game doesn't have much of a place.

Edited by the author 4 years ago
Spikestuff, BlitzPhoenix98 and 5 others like this
United Kingdom

i see what you are saying CDRomatron

Colorado, USA

I think that this is what Len was saying when he said there's nothing stopping you from pausing and leaving the levels. The fact that the bosses are locked on a new game is the thing that prevents you from doing exactly that in Any%/106%. It's unnecessarily hard to verify runs of a category like this, and it's far too similar to Any% for reasons that aren't too great. 106% is a great category to see all of the game, but you could also consider something along the lines of All Gems up to the warp room 5 boss, ignoring relics and warp room 6. There are options, and you can run the game however you want. It's difficult to justify a board like this though, especially given the small interest in the playstyle.

Edited by the author 4 years ago
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