I looked at it but at the same time... There are basically 5 fights on that day? And it gets replaced almost immediately. It's probably close.

Maybe run Ribbon Bonnet over Star Cap permanently, as the time loss for buying Ribbon Bonnet (about 5 seconds) should be less than the time saved for the D3 fights. It's also a ¥6000 save. Any extra money you have by W2D4 or W2D6 goes into buying ATK Capsules, so this seems good.

Star Cap's ability (sync +20) isn't necessary, considering that Punchy only used her fusion against Cornix Canor.

It's ¥1800 in the JP version, which means the JP wiki was incorrect.

The main reason for separating Co-op is that it's only available for one version and that makes adding it as a general thing weird with the version variables. But I guess it wouldn't be a problem rules-wise if everyone has no problem with merging them.

Merge it. It still hasn't been proven that 2P2C is faster than 1P2C. The current 2P2C time is 19 minutes off the 1P2C time, and that was with 0 bounties on W3D6/W3D7.

All secret reports is a niche category, as some pigs will need to be claimed in the maingame, and food consumption would be targeted more towards BRV to enable equips like Samurai Wig/Biker Gloves. Because it significantly changes the any% normal routing, I'm personally not interested. SOS likely wouldn't work well in A New Day because of "restore" dissonance noise fights. But it would work everywhere else.

As for NG+, I think it's a dead category with the current rules tbh, which feel way too restrictive. The current NG+ rules were designed to give the NG experience without the slow text speed. However, FR has given NG fast text speed, thus making the current NG+ rules superfluous. Also, current any% normal runs are now using permanent ATK+ food. I feel NG+ should just allow players to go wild with whatever stats and equips on ultimate difficulty for the goal of shortest ultimate completion time possible. It would also allow anyone to submit a NG+ run with their current save instead of wiping it just because they used stat-boosting food.

NG+ surely is less interesting in this version, the time difference will not be as drastic with text speed and how generally easier everything is. It'll not be that interesting in general since it'll just be killing everything in seconds with Lightning Rook, so I personally have no interest in it.

As for its rules, the main reason the stat cap was used is because previous version only have one savefile, meaning that if someone wanted to grind to max stats and get every good equipment for NG+ runs and then they wanted to switch to another category, they would have to spend a really long time to get the stats again. Stat grinding is not nearly as bad in Final Remix and you can have multiple savefiles with Switch accounts, so that part of the rules is not suited for it. It's not like they could've predicted this, because when the rules were made (during ESA 2017) Final Remix wasn't even announced.

I personally don't want to modify the global rules to cater to one version in particular, they are already murky enough to allow some stuff (pins at any/max level, Anguis, etc.)

oh yeah while we're talking about NG+ rules, they seem to specify King Pendant as a banned item for being "post-game"

Is that a DS thing or what?

incidentally I'm favourable to unrestricted NG+

The item ban list was compiled from my own testing of items that were available to buy before and after the credits, it may have been changed in Final Remix or it may have been a mistake on my part, I honestly don't know.

King Pendant has always been available in the maingame.

One last equip to consider: Goth Bondage Coat on W3D2 for Beat. GBC is ATK +27, but induces SOS. However, unlike the other SOS clothes, you can immediately heal at the start of a fight, and GBC's ATK will stay at +27. Cost is an issue. However, the JP wiki claims that GBC is unlocked at FSG Lv3, while in DS, it was unlocked at FSG Lv5. Test this, because I can't check myself. As for required materials, the W3D1 pigs give you 2 Tektite, and 1 Sleek Silk was given via a wall on W1D6.

EDIT: Replaced wall of text with an updated table.

• W1D3: Bye-bye Star Cap!
• W2D4: Both BRAVE+ are bought for Beat because he needs to consume 2. Neku's BRAVE+ is deferred until W3D5.
• W3D2: Cash out to ¥84k instead of ¥33k. Look at the table for details.
• W3D5: Negotiator is skipped. Neku's BRAVE+ is bought.
• W3D7: If you feel risky, put the GBC on Neku before Kitaniji.

The table has removed some equips which only give ATK +1. Those skips will save money and time because you enter 3 less shops. (Funky Shades isn't worth the extra money and time.)

Beat's ATK should be a whopping 64 at the beginning of W3D4 instead of 40, because Beat will equip the King Pendant and the GBC at the same time. This should save significant time for the 11 fights on that day, and for the rest of the game. Bonus: A random reaper bounty on W3D2 or W3D3 allows GBC + King Pendant to be equipped against Uzuki. If you don't get one, you saved time anyway. Win-win!

Punchy, you expressed concern that the run being >3h is awkward for festival submissions. Try an any% easy run next time and see if that's sub-3h. The only change from any% normal is that Reaper Beat should probably be fought all three times instead of dodging. The easy run would also have a bit less money to work with.

Any% easy should be a new category for FR because it'd be the "pure speed" category. Maybe retire the "all secret reports" category, because it's lame to see someone play the game twice in one run, and no one has submitted anything for it yet.

Tried it, GBC unlocks at FSG Lvl 5 on english Switch. I don't have the Japanese version to test, but nothing else seems to be different between JP/ENG on Final Remix so I'd be kinda surprised if that's the thing that differs

My vote:

Merge 1P2C and 2P2C until it's clear that 2P2C has an advantage that 1P2C can't overcome.

Categories:

• Any% easy (pure speed)
• Any% normal (the traditional run)
• NG+ ultimate, no stat/equip restrictions (Ultimate difficulty is to make it different than any% easy, and is logical because ultimate is postgame only. It'll still be fast, but at least there might be unique pins/setups used.)

And retire the current NG+ and all secret reports. I know they're your pet categories Herreteman, and you put a lot of work into them, but sorry man, nobody is going to run those anymore. Current NG+ is too restrictive, and all secret reports feels like a crippled 100% attempt because the runner plays through the story twice but doesn't end up getting 100%.

FR does make it possible to 100% the game using a single device without long waits. What if someone were crazy enough to attempt 100% in one go using date changes? Hey, if someone can 100% Baten Kaitos in 2 weeks...

At some point there needs to be a standardized list of acceptable runs that are run by at least 2 people.

What if I submitted a "no food" run or a "no equip" run or a "only same brand" run? Or some other run where I make up some arbitrary ruleset that nobody else has vetted? They wouldn't go up. At this point I feel current NG+ and "all secret reports" are derived rulesets made up by one person. The latter has zero submissions.

The most accepted categories are:

• Any% where any and all in-game means (including sequence breaks and glitches) are used to complete the game ASAP. This is any% easy because once you get the easy sticker, nothing is stopping you from using it.

• Any% normal for this game has been run by the most people over the years, including people who haven't submitted here yet like me and TLPlexa, so it has that going for it.

• NG+ should have a less restrictive ruleset. If ultimate difficulty only isn't preferable, then we could discuss other options.

By the way, I don't mind the status quo if push comes to shove. I just gave my $0.02 on the matter, that's all.

I don't want to turn this into a category drama, but let me say a few words on the categories you say should be removed:

• NG+ is not "my pet category", I actually routed it per request of a guy called St4rwave, who wanted to run this game but couldn't really afford to do 5 hour runs. He contacted me directly during ESA 2017 for that, and during a big portion of that night I exchanged DMs with Eekcast trying to make a set of rules that made sense. After returning home (+ about a week to get back my TWEWY cart from my lost luggage) I started testing, compiling stuff, making a route and running it. Unfortunately those rules don't really fit Final Remix in particular, it's a much different game and it wasn't even a thing back then. St4rwave didn't end up fully learning it, so my runs and NegativePro's Solo Remix runs are the only ones there for now.

• All Secret Reports is closer to a pet category because I'm the only one crazy enough for now to run it. Doesn't mean it's not a category that should exist, 100% completion is not feasible as a run in any version (although slightly better in Final Remix) so it's a more reasonable category based on unlocking everything the game offers. It's a very good challenge run in NDS, it may be more scuffed in other versions, but I wouldn't be against routing and running it for Final Remix in the future.

I like the idea of changing the tabs from categories to versions, it suits the differences between versions more. Changing everything to that may take a while (including re-categorizing runs), so when I find the time I'll try to do it, including merging the co-op and solo leaderboards. Sorry for not doing that earlier, I've been busy with other projects and IRL stuff so the only TWEWY-related thing I've done is getting closer to 100% mastered pins.

Enough category drama for now, back to routing discussion

• GBC is ridiculously good because ATK +27 is way above anything else you can buy. I'm getting personal best splits even on DS with it, and it really should be in every future run. It doesn't require you to get any materials, because you already have the 2 Tektite and Sleek Silk.

• In order to equip GBC, Beat must consume 2 BRAVE+. Neku can wear it immediately without BRAVE+ but only if he has consumed 9 ice cream. Otherwise, he must consume 1 BRAVE+. I feel that due to partner efficiency, and the knockback penalty for wearing it, GBC is better on Beat. Biker Jacket on Neku is still ATK +15.

• The buy order for GBC in the chart inadvertently unlocks the abilities of Blond Wig and Mini-crown, which wastes a few seconds. Here's a better buy order, given that you bought Ribbon Bonnet on W1D3: 3 Lace Bonnet, Ribbon Bonnet, Vampire Dress, 2x (3 Lace Bonnet + Ribbon Bonnet). This doesn't unlock any extra abilities, and is slightly less expensive (¥51090 vs ¥51480). Enjoy your 4 second time save lol

• Cure Drink goes in the deck upon equipping GBC. Using Cure Drink immediately at the start of a fight puts your HP at 75%. However, this only leaves you with 3 attacking pins, because the current plan is to keep Poison Bones in the deck until NP Resonance. Choose your 3 attacking pins wisely.

• If Beat consumes the 3rd BRAVE+ instead of Neku on W3D5, Beat will wear Pi-Face's Cap. He'd only be able to eat 1 hot dog to do this. If you want to do this, Neku only needs 6 ice cream for the whole game: he gets BRV 45 by W2D6, enough for Red Mohawk Set. In DS, Neku wants Pi-Face's Cap to reduce the damage he takes from Kitaniji's projectiles. But in Remix, it doesn't matter who gets the DEF +25.

• I'm not sure switching pendants at the end of the game saves any time. The possibility of Beat having ATK 79 (Sneaks/Pi-Face's Cap/GBC/King Pendant, 3 ATK stickers, 1 hot dog) for Kitaniji and Anguis is very appealing, and if this is good enough to prevent using fusion Lv3 on Kitaniji, that more than makes up for the inevitable time loss on Draco.

• Crazy but maybe actually awesome idea: On W2D7, detour to Shibukyu Main Store and defeat the sleeping pig (far right side -- scan quick or else a taboo symbol might get you, use the Switch home menu to KO it) for the Archangel pin. Use Archangel as your healing pin instead of Cure Drink, because Archangel is HP +70% and will activate instantly, putting your HP at a fresh 95%. Neku gets to fight a half-second earlier.

• For W2 Tektite farming, you need 2 total for Joshua and Beat's Lv3 fusion stickers, because GBC uses up the Tektite from the W3D1 pigs. But to be honest, I feel Joshua's Lv3 isn't worth it because it's only for Sho. Maybe consider pin slot 6 over Joshua's Lv3 instead, as Cure Drink/Archangel uses a slot. Both upgrades require 2 Scarletite/1 Tektite. (Pin slot 6 needs 1 extra Rare Metal.)

between y'all I actually feel like Final/Solo Remix and the DS original probably ought to have had separate boards rather than the current organisation, because they're pretty different. DS NG+ makes enough sense for DS, not so much FR.

it's not really too late to pull that off or anything, so might as well put that forward.

I kinda like the scrappy organic experimentation where I peek into streams and make on-the-fly suggestions that may or may not work :p

• Insta-fusion on Tigris fails in FR. Worked in DS and SR, oh well

• I've been observing everyone's Tigris phase 1. People are losing several seconds by waiting for the taboo wolves to run into the pit. Well, you get Live Slow Die Fast (Psychokinesis T) on W2D4 from the story. In FR, it evolves to June Hearth January Fan, which lets you pick up enemies. I know a lot of runners avoid Psychokinesis, but the T variant isn't that cumbersome to use compared to the D and S variants. Maybe try out that pin, and if it works out, you save some seconds off the Tigris fight because you can just toss the wolves into the pit. Cool.

Minor concept I wanna spitball, but perhaps it's worth considering skipping Shiki's Fusion Boost. You only ever use a fusion once during her week on Cornix and a Level 1 is totally sufficient to one shot. We never actually use a level 2 at any point and it's probably a DS route holdover unless I'm missing something.

This would save you two Scarletite to do...something with?

I've considered using that extra two Scarletite to pick up the Extra Slot from Edoga 104 (it appears on week 2 day 5 but you don't have to grab it that early), which would also take an additional four rare metal and one tektite. You can take care of the tektite during the one bit where you farm for Tektite. The four rare metal are probably worth grabbing to have an extra damage pin whenever you can grab it (I would use Casual Pendulum particularly because with the Goth Bondage Coat you have Cure Drink eating a slot I'd otherwise use for it.)

• Not getting Shiki's Lv2 Fusion means you can get Safe Landing @Edoga immediately. The Lv2 was used to save time on DS because you can fusion the last chain in a battle, but :26 fusions in Remix means it's no good. Safely skip it in FR if you want.

• I've made a list of every single viable equip here. A bunch of it is DS only (because I'm currently routing it) but there's info for FR: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1C_MFV8RcXwcIZYbUoTv7TkLJxp1fWRDO47mgKtIneWw

• I've changed my mind about getting Funky Shades; it's now in the DS run and works for FR. Get it so that you get the Choice Meat from the 104 wall @ W1D7, and then you can grab Definitivo Chili Dog on W2D4 for Beat after he consumes 2 BRAVE+. This requires 0 backtracking: you already go to the Scramble on W1D7 to fight ravens, and you pass by Mexican Dog on W2D4. It needs 3 Rare Metal, and Beat will digest in time for the berserk fight. This means you buy only 3 hot dogs, all for Joshua.

• Tektite is such a pain in the ass to get in DS, so now my DS route doesn't get any. But it's much easier to get in FR, so you could consider Patchy Biker Jacket. However it requires considerable farming time and slight backtracking (you need to buy 2 Durable Leather). I'm leaning towards NO for this.

• Camouflage is worth heavy consideration; it's now in the DS run and replaces Beat's Purple Sneaks. If Beat has San Fran/GBC/King Pendant, Camouflage is equivalent to ATK +12 until you heal out of SOS. Get in some extra damage for the first few seconds of a fight.

• Adamantite isn't worth it. CAT Deck is obtained after W3D4, so there's no time save to be had at all.

• Beat needs 2 BRAVE+ for GBC. Who gets the 3rd BRAVE+? If Beat gets it, he can wear Pi-Face's Cap for Kitaniji. This can put Beat at ATK 96 (10 base + 9 stickers + 3 chili dog + 27 GBC + 16 pendant + 15 cap * 1.2 camouflage) but you'd lose a few seconds in the Draco fight. If Neku gets it, Beat would have ATK -10, but Neku would have ATK +8 over San Fran. For DS, I'd give it to Beat because you can't cheese Kitaniji with a Lv3. But for FR, giving it to Neku is probably best.

Concept: buy Goth Bondage Coat for Joshua.

W1D5: Purchase a Crepe instead of a Hot Dog and save it for Joshua. W2D2: use a fusion when farming Tektite to guarantee 3 tektite drops, one for Joshua's fusion, two for GBC. (or just yolo it it does happen) W2D3: in my current PB by this day Joshua has hit 50 BRV with no boosts (he starts at 39 + whatever your level is), so +4 from Crepe should put it up to 54 BRV which is exactly what you need for Goth Bondage Coat, at near enough exactly when it's possible to buy it here when you visit A-East

W2D6: you may need to put off buying the 3 x Sparkling Silvers and 3 x Brave + until this point if you buy GBC that early to make sure you have enough money, but honestly money isn't that tight throughout this run? You're dropping an assload of pins all the time.

doing this would let you have GBC as early as Day 3 for Joshua which would presumably save a chunk of time across the remainder of his days

flaws:

• there's not actually that many fights in his days from that point but idk you still need to buy it for Beat anyway
• conflicts with Denim Blouse for W2D5 D+B Wall
• where the hell do I put cure pin in a deck with only four slots!! (maybe just yolo it and don't at all)

Felt like sharing nevertheless, maybe it gives some of you a think.

You can't get GBC before W3D2, because you can't buy Vampire Dress until W3D2. :(

Maybe Patchy Biker Jacket can be used for Joshua because you can get it as early as W2D4 or W2D5 with less backtracking. But the time save from W2D6+ must be huge for it to be worth it. Getting PBJ probably eats an extra 2-3 minutes. (Get 5 Tektite, buy 2 Durable Leather at Q-Heads, then backtrack to Molco to get it... OR wait until W2D5 after you clear all the walls because the PBJ would only be used for the crab fight anyway.)

The other potential big time save is actually using Tin Pin Thrift. But it's very risky in FR, and the ATK +30% affects only Neku. My DS run uses Tin Pin Thrift until Beat can wear the GBC.

Also, I honestly don't think you need Joshua's lv3. I saw it do 11k damage to Sho, but Sho only has 3141 HP, and the lv2 is 1/3 the strength of the lv3. A lv2 at 5.3X should one-shot Sho.

Hey. Been a while since there's been discussion. Due to the recent charity speedruns (shout out to Ouro, Ghoul02, and Punchi), some people have expressed interest in running this game, but were looking for a one-stop resource. I've put together as much general information as I could here: https://www.speedrun.com/twewy/guide/0t37c

Let me know if there are corrections, things I should include, etc. Hopefully we can see more runners and optimize this towards sub-3h!