Actually howling at you manipulating votes once again Plywood. You have taken into account votes from non runners multiple times in the past when it supported the position you wanted

I threw my vote in so I could see you do this in real time and get a laugh out of it

"Why do the MGSR discord and anonymous votes count?"
They are on the leaderboard and didn't post on this thread. Anyone who is on the leaderboard gets a vote. The other moderators can verify this to ensure no one is voting who shouldn't be.

If you previously had runs on the leaderboard and removed them, the decision making doesn't affect you in the same way people who have runs on the leaderboard. If in your case you don't want to be on the leaderboards because of those who are managing them (or whatever reason), that's your prerogative. To then return when a decision is being made for a space you don't want to be involved in and expect full voting rights, I do not agree with.

I reached out to site staff to clarify the rules. Rules reference runners, and my interpretation is runners who have runs on speedrun.com of the game. I brought this up with 2 other moderators who had no objection, but I am not going to take a big stand on it.

I'm all for it being included, I think it's a great improvement to the pc version and imo could only draw more engagement into new people running it.

@PlywoodPlywood

Your stance on this is quite different compared to your previous stances.

https://imgur.com/a/NDM0C5I

@PlywoodPlywood
You realize that your actions are the reasons multiple peoples runs are no longer listed including my own. My runs were not removed because "I disagreed with who runs the board" I removed my runs long before a moderation change even took place on SRDC.
I removed them because of you giving away the MGSR server without talking to literally ANYBODY in MGSR. I disassociated from the community because of your actions directly, and the toxicity created by the new leaders you appointed without informing anyone.
I removed my runs because your community made me uncomfortable. Over time I have grown and by making and extending friendships in LC I decided to return to the boards. My SRDC account was re-made before this thread was created, not to argue for analog, but because I believed it would pass unanimously and I was eager to submit runs to the board again with the new patch, as it reignited my interest in the game.
You can literally see me running Any% and practicing all bosses here 10 days ago:
This thread was created 4 days ago.
You know yourself I'm a runner of this game, and you are trying to exclude me, along with anybody else who removed their runs, to get your way.
If you truly cared about the community this would be a vote for all runners of the game.
You know that your actions caused these runs to be removed, and now you are using that to your advantage.

However I'm sure you have jumped through every mental gymnastic to justify your position, and its this kind of behavior you're putting on display right now that caused people to remove their runs. I honestly cannot believe the audacity of this.

Also saying this only affects runners who have runs on the boards is so disingenuous.
This affects all future runners too, and as someone who literally was actively trying to get an impressive time to post on SRDC. I'm a future (and current) runner who is being effected by this.
Stop with the elitist take that this only effects "people who are stakeholders in the boards." You know that's a lie, this effects everyone who plans on submitting to the boards.

We're seriously going to tell new runners "yeah analog exists but you cant use it because the minority knowingly excluded the majority during the poll for it"

People that haven't played the game in 5 years get to vote. But not people who are ready to submit right now???

My vote goes to yes. I think Analog movement is a great improvement for the PC version.
It may also attract new runners to run this game or gets old runners back to running this again.

Hi I'm all for analog but at the same time I don't really run this so I guess my vote counts for not caring about whether my old time is beaten by this change lol.

Edit: oh seems my vote from MGSR discord was counted. Always thought this would be the official place to vote especially now that there's a split community although people wanting to vote privately makes sense too.

@VolcanicAkuma55VolcanicAkuma55
Top screenshot is about what can be done among MGS2 runners about whether to allow Load Trick or not, in response to Raichu joking that his vote wouldn't count because he was a verifier and not a moderator. Bottom post doesn't contradict what is happening here: runners have primary value in a vote and who else to include on a voting level beyond that is up for discussion. Some communities have systems in place where people gain voting rights to some degree based on their influence on a game or series. The perspective of former/inactive runners still has value, I don't think it should be completely ignored.

@ApacheSmashApacheSmash
Please stop baiting and trolling then.

@KingofTheBeezKingofTheBeez
Decisions made always affect future and potential runs, but hypothetical runners are just that. Votes are from the people who want to be there and they can make their case based on whatever evidence or feelings they have. Besides that, everyone should look in their mirrors.

I received a response from website moderation. I believe they made a typo by saying "runs" instead of "votes," but it is deemed acceptable. Users of SRC are welcome to submit their runs to the leaderboard to be counted for any future votes.

https://imgur.com/a/3jBIYs9

Just thinking what the alternative is. If we don’t allow this patch, can we just open a board on the CE at least? I will run this. Board or not, would be nice to have a place for it still after everything.

Votes appear to be majority yes, so I see no reason why this wouldn’t be allowed.

When can we expect to see the results? Thread has been up for a week now and regardless of the holidays, any runner who’s active enough to care has probably already cast their vote.

@PlywoodPlywood

Multiple votes which affect SRDC have been held in this community and anyone was allowed to vote and be counted not just people on the board. Off the top of my head the LT decision, IGT/RTA for MGS2 and the MGS3 boards layout. There's more but these are just the ones I remember this second.

Every time we had a discussion about who was allowed to vote, it was decided that everyone should be allowed to take part. So it's noteworthy to see you do a full 180 on this especially as someone who was a vocal supporter of giving everyone a voice.

I've always been in support of only runners on the board getting a vote. My feelings on that doesn't flipflop depending on how I think a vote will go and concern that I might not get my own way.

I've called you out for rigging votes to sway things the way you personally want them in the past and it's just a trend that is continuing here. Your actions are further vindicating everything I've said about the way you handle votes almost the entire time I've been playing these games.

The added caveat of saying you must have a run on the board before the vote was called is hilarious when it takes the current mods of this game 25 days to watch a WR run. It's such an obvious way to block people who might disagree with you personally and it's transparent. It also shows that the current team is less proactive in verifying runs as they are in preventing people from coming in and taking part.

It's not even that long ago you were a champion of being able to withdraw participation from the boards at anytime and now without even flinching you are openly punishing people for stepping away with this vote.

Sorry for "Trolling and Baiting" but I felt it was worth pointing out.

Snow has a run on the board. It's the anonymous run for EZ Any%. If this is the method of voting, add Snow to the count of yes. (Yes, I have permission from @young_sn0wyoung_sn0w to say that run is his).

Re: @Hau5testHau5test CE seems very pointless for me. Just would be more clutter for something that should be on main without a doubt.

Re: slow verifiers. I used to be a super mod and have offered to help. Everyone knows I'm fast and accurate when moderating. Up to them to do the right thing. Shame really when WR runs take 10+ (or 25 days) to verify. Shoutout to @repeatzzzzzrepeatzzzzz for verifying, but more passionate runners need to be added. Separate topic, don't want de-rail this thread as this was in response to @ApacheSmashApacheSmash.

https://www.speedrun.com/mgs1/run/z0l0q64z = Renflower, which needs to be yes

re: being slow. at least if you want to take shots at me specifically, DM me about that one if you want. Im only going to explain my perspective involving private things in private, this simply isnt the place. repeatzzzz coming on when he did was a godsend at least from my perspective at the time. very appreciative for volunteering his time to the board.

re: WRs, these don't get or deserve verification priority, at least from me. sorry. if it was watched live as it happened thatd be one thing but they're still just another run on the spreadsheet.

on topic: i and others have agreed that if you chose not to submit your time or decided to remove it of your own volition thats on you, sorry. you should be in or not imo. if you dont want to be part of the board why do you care about what the rules of said board are?
@dlimes13dlimes13 that's fine imo since there's granted permission of dropping the anonymity in this case (even more so if he confirms that), vote should be counted. whether other mods agree or not is up to them.

@MetalGlennSolidMetalGlennSolid
I liked being part of the board, I'm trying to be a part of the board.
I stopped being part of the board given the uncomfortable environment brewing in the community, as well as many others.
Having every message you sent in a private server articulated in some weird hit piece kind of took a toll on people.
I hate this being spun simply as people threw a tantrum and deleted their runs.
Sorry to keep bringing this up, but if we are using deleted runs as a reason for exclusion from the community, I believe its important to highlight why people felt the need to remove their runs.

@PlywoodPlywood
Also once again, please consider how votes have always been counted in the past compared to this vote.
I personally don't care how SRDC responded to you or even see how that is relevant. I never thought you were breaking site rules, I'm pointing out the blatant hypocrisy of how you wanted to tally votes in this poll vs the past.

On the topic of slow verification and WR prioritization.

I don't think anyone expects WRs to be verified first, but 25 days for a historically significant run is kind of insane.
We understand people have personal lives, but its wrong for people to wait a month to have their WR achievement verified, by the time its on the board it could already be beaten.
Its even more wrong whenever you have someone who has an insanely good track record with verification and board management trying to volunteer to help again and you refuse it because of a grudge, whenever the current team of 6 can't keep up as it is.

@KingofTheBeezKingofTheBeez more than willing to discuss over DMs, since I don't want to de-rail this any more. This is open to any of you, my DMs have been set to shared servers due to scams going around tho so feel free to use mine if we dont the link isnt hard to find.

At the end of the day everybody has to abide by these rules set. So on the topic of the discussion, the main point I'm trying to make is: I removed my runs because of the environment in MGSR, but I would like to submit to the boards again, when I submit I will have to abide by whatever rules are set at that time.

Its a completely arbitrary restriction to say if I had submitted one Any% run on the board back in 2010 and was never active until today I would have a valid vote. But people who had a run on the board less than a year ago and have since removed it are not allowed to vote at all.
Especially when I raced this game on the MGSR Twitch channel against Glenn, and Apache ran it at UKSG.

@MetalGlennSolidMetalGlennSolid

My comment was to point out the rush to exclude anyone not on the board right now but when it comes to accepting people onto the board it's taking the better part of a month. It was not meant to single out any verifier or their personal circumstances.

And Finally
@PlywoodPlywood In response to "Decisions made always affect future and potential runs, but hypothetical runners are just that."

That's true and new runners have to abide by the rules set before they arrived, I'm not expecting that to change. However we are here and present for this vote, and I'd put a run in the queue right now if it meant my vote would be counted, because I want to run this game with analog.

Rules set in 1998 affect the runs posted in 2022, but todays runners were not present in any form when those rules were made, we are here right now. You have changed the way polls have always been done in the series in order to exclude us and backed it up with an SRDC mod screenshot, even though you violating site rules was never even in question.