United StatesVideo proof will be required for at least the fastest time, but right now, picture proof for all other times is acceptable.
First off, one thing to note is that the lengths of the fire decrease with repeated use. It's kinda hard to see but if you full-screen that fire cancel clip it shows the length of each fire. When I first started out, I didn't realize this so I was underestimating how long the first and second fires were. Some people even mash A for the float input.
I think the most common mistake is to float for too long before doing the puff. Those two inputs (float and puff) are really close together, though I don't know the exact # of frames. I suppose you could play back one of the TASes with inputs, but I haven't seen anyone use an input display for this game.
Overall, getting a feel for the correct timing takes awhile (for me personally it was maybe 3-4 weeks, but I was doing any% for most of that time), so don't get discouraged if it doesn't seem to be very effective yet.
Hi, I was the one who changed the settings, for exactly the reasoning in kirbymastah's post. Apologies for doing this after accepting your first runs--for a long time, there were no emulator runs at all (minus one joke submission) so the issue never came up. Thanks for your understanding.
Hey, sorry I didn't see this earlier. I think Extra 100% has a lot of interesting opportunities for routing differences--there is a run by Jessepinwheel (probably just going through the levels in order), but later on she simply did regular 100%.
One major issue with the in-game time is that it appears to round down the IGT to the nearest second after you exit a level. For example, you can repeatedly enter and pause+exit a stage without the IGT advancing. Theoretically, this can cause a ~50 second gap in measurement between two nearly-identical runs even when the real difference could be very small.
Another complaint I have is about the types of actions you can do outside of stages. One thing that's common to both runs is dealing with your bubble inventory as you're going through a stage. For example, during the Dedede fight, people do two-bubble mixes (usually for wheel) while slashing with the sword because there's not much time afterwards to do it. Being able to push these mixes to level selects takes the stress off by eliminating the need to multitask in several places.
Perhaps more crucial is doing ?-bubble mixes. Mixes can be interrupted by choosing a level or doing that transition between world select and level select. This means that doing these bubble mixes would take very little skill (e.g. if you know the mix won't stop on candy, just go into a level), when normally it's considered to be one of the hardest and most timesaving strategies in both any% and 100%.
However, I wouldn't be opposed to adding Extra 100% as a miscellaneous category if there's more interest.
I personally don't feel like it's necessary to split the leaderboards, even though the VC version is, from my estimation, about ~1:10 faster (not including the Dedede timesave from the J v1.0 version). If other N64 runners feel strongly about this, please let me know.
As far as I can tell, from Peril1337's 2010 run onwards, the majority of top runners, including all record holders (I believe 0xwas used N64 for some of his older runs), used some VC version (i.e. regular Wii VC or Dream Collection). In this sense VC can be considered the main version to run the game on.
Looking at related games, the Kirby series does not have any leaderboards that are split, even ones where there has been competition at the top between runners of different versions with noticeably different loading times/lag (e.g. Super Star, Squeak Squad). The impression I got was that people of those respective communities either didn't care, or they were in favor of keeping the leaderboards combined. One could argue--in both directions--about how the leaderboards are arranged encourages or discourages prospective runners from picking up the game. Personally, I wanted to keep the leaderboards combined, but did runs of the N64 version to not only better gauge the time differences (e.g., I wanted to dispel the claim that VC saved possibly up to 2 minutes over N64) but to set a standard for people filtering for "N64 only."
For other N64 games, I found that more games with a VC version are actually not split (most notably Ocarina of Time, where people are doing version-exclusive glitches). The situation for some other games arose when the newly released Wii U VC version turned out to be faster, threatening to obsolete people's work put into the N64 version. If I recall correctly, those boards were not split prior to that, even when one of those games went through a period where VC was believed to be faster. One compromise I've seen, which is to have both a combined and split ranking, is purely cosmetic, in my opinion.
There's a leaderboard on cyberscore for 100-Yard Hop: https://cyberscore.me.uk/game/349
I also have a 1p4c video whose times I didn't submit to the leaderboards:
When Suzuri was doing 100% runs, he made a rule for himself that he wouldn't skip the credits, so that's what I did as well. In the rules, it's not strictly prohibited (just like how traditionally, everyone has done 1P for best ending), but I didn't even bother to check that resetting during credits still unlocks Boss Butch.
I agree with changing it to what Demolition proposed. I've retimed the other runs to:
MHFsilver - 31:49.91
golderzoa - 29:04.40 and 29:39.21
If we're all on board with this I'm going to edit the rules and the runs.
Hey JoeyS111, there's a Kirby speedrunning discord with several KSSU runners in it. You can find an invite link in the Kirby series page.
I was the one who changed it "back" to what it was before. There were two things that were addressed:
-Meta Knightmare being split from the main mode -MK 100% moved to miscellaneous.
For the first point, Meta Knightmare is distinct from the main mode, even though they're playing through the same levels. Some major differences include use of in-game time, not fighting Nightmare, no goal games, and not being able to save. In my opinion, having both Kirby and Meta Knight as two tabs underneath the category names on the leaderboards suggests that these two modes are pretty much identical except for character choice.
I asked some MK runners on their thoughts about MK 100%, and while some of them liked the category, I think the general concensus was that the category is arbitrary and difficult to check (see, e.g., the status of All Items in KDL1). I spoke to neskamikaze a long time ago about the category, and he said that the reason he ran 100% was just because of the healing, and that any% was the real category. After defeating Dedede, the game doesn't give you a 100% screen like in the main mode, and you can't go back to the level select rooms to check the door colors. For this reason, MK runs are just "Meta Knightmare" and not "Meta Knightmare any%," following the convention of other games (see KDL1 again) where it's just called "Beat the Game."
Like Zelgan said, this also fixes the default livesplit WR text. E.g. if you just specified "Any%" it would give you the MK record, but in order to get it to show the main mode record, you needed to set a variable. This is a really minor benefit, though.
As far as I know, anyone can add a guide to a game. I'll learn the game someday, promise!
EDIT: by the way, seckswrecks ran this game in the Kirby marathon two years ago:
There's a general Kirby speedrunning discord. You can find an invite link in the Kirby series forum.
Unlike those in later games like Return to Dream Land, Boss Butch categories for games like KDL3 and K64 are less compelling because the lack of abilities makes them slow-paced and highly luck-dependent. On a really minor note, there isn't an in-game timer, so in some sense it's less "natural" to track them.
In the past, runners of these games have also done Boss Butch runs, but none of them seemed to express interest in leaderboards (or in some cases, even saving their PBs).
Hi, glad to see you're interested in running this game! As AnimeGameKid said, emulators like Project64 or Mupen64 aren't allowed for this game because they're inaccurate. For example, this game has a lot of graphical glitches on emulator, like the HP bar being incorrect, some objects being invisible, backgrounds displaying incorrectly, etc.
One option is to record your TV screen with a webcam or a phone (see Seraki's run for a great example of this). Alternatively, you could practice on emulator while waiting for a capture card to arrive.
I tried to edit the leaderboards to introduce as little clutter as possible. I didn't know people would be so deeply offended by a few letters.
Edit: Anyways, I think the distinction is still worth representing. This edit at least changes the "VC" portion of it.
