What data are we allowed to see from external tools and where are the limits?
Deleted
5 years ago
Germany

As @Teo- said somewhere else - the Diablo Interface is already kind of in a grey area.

It's hard to tell where said grey area starts and where it ends and so far we don't have a set boundaries. Some might say automagically keeping track of your runes, resistances and gold is cheating, others might prefer sitting in an airplane-cockpit with flashing lights that remind you to fill your tp-tome or a tool that reads the map seed and checks which path you have to take to 1-way the summoner.

Personally I prefer watching people who can play without all that fancy crap.

The Diablo Interface was supposed to be (and it currently is) a cool feature for viewers - as far as I know at least - so I'd say let's try keeping it that way. Once people start abusing this or similar tools we'll have to get rid of them and that would make people sad. Try not to overdo it.

Germany

The goal of Diablo Interface and the twitch extension was to provide the viewers a way to see the important things in that happen in the speedrun.

As far as I know the twitch extension had a set goal to replace the interface completly (apart from the auto split function). Unfortunately I haven't heard from the creator of the extension in a while. That's why we are currently stuck in a semi-optimal situation with a lot of programs running.

We can't control what people have displayed on their screens. That and the constant questions from the viewers for the items and current stats is the main reason why we allowed it in the first place. (My opinion) I personally have the Diablo Interface running but minimized so I don't see it myself.

In my opinion the best solution would be all the current information from Diablo Interface moving into the extension with a way to configure which runes you are looking for without a fix output on the streamer display. That way the runner would have to activly have his own stream open to view the stuff. As I said there is no way to control this stuff 100%. We can only limit it.

Germany

You only can control what they choose to show you on the stream You can not control what they actually have on their screens at home. Diablo Interface is out there and there is no way to make it disappear.

Maine, USA

"It changes the way character stats are shown and it also lists stats that you can't normally see. So any modification is not allowed, but Diablo Interface is okay? Why?"

I don't really disagree with your main point about the hypocrisy of the interface usage. But, for the sake of discussion, let me propose this question: Do you think there is a difference between observation and modification?

The D2:LoD program is still running on your computer, functioning like it always has. Diablointerface doesn't cause D2:LoD to do something else. Diablointerface is the program responsible for doing other things. From a certain point of view, it could be argued that the interface is an observer and NOT a modifier. Lav's earlier 'airplane cockpit' scenario could even be argued as being within current the rules against modification.

Edited by the author 5 years ago
Maine, USA

Teo said: "the best solution would be all the current information from Diablo Interface moving into the extension. That way the runner would have to activly have his own stream open to view the stuff."

This would still leave it open for someone to make an 'airplane cockpit' running 3 extensions that display every imaginable attribute on 3 other monitors for them to look at.

Edited by the author 5 years ago
Maine, USA

Here's my suggestion:

Mods designate a list of approved, PUBLICLY AVAILABLE programs that are allowed to be used. If someone wants to try to make an airplane cockpit, they can. But they can only submit runs with it if they make it available to everyone AND after the mods (humans using their subjective judgement) allow it. This is pretty much the same philosophy that sports leagues use to manage equipment. The officials decide which equipment is allowed.

I think this would be a good idea because it would promote development of new Diablo-related tools. This would be a good thing for everyone who loves D2 and wants to see it flourish, especially regarding streaming popularity. If we had taken the other approach (hard line against modifications) then we probably wouldn't even HAVE the tools we have now to be debating in this conversation.

d2 is one of the easiest games to modify, cheating is likely rampant on these boards, to suggest otherwise is a delusion, drop rates can be ever so slightly tweaked, mob density can be tweaked, a random mob can be set up to loot a lucky drop, i have no idea why anyone would take the leaderboards seriously, just have fun and don't worry about what others are using.

ioupain likes this
Germany

PlugY is a mod and thus not allowed. Diablo Interface is not a mod.

You are allowed to look at / display the data the current version of 'Diablo Interface' allows you to display. (plus the D2ID-twitch app, that enables twitch viewers to look at your gear)

In the long run this limit may change!

Personally I would prefer something easier as limit - something like "char screen and equipped items". That would be almost the same information that is currently being read/displayed by 'Diablo Interface' but would remove some things I am unhappy with (automatically adding FCR/FHR/FRW/IAS including stats from charms, automatically (and badly) tracking runes).

I do not want to force people into messy short term solutions. If anything I would want to have a proper long-term solution ready if I were to change something like this. Unfortunately I just do not have the skills to create the ideal tool.

Edited by the author 5 years ago
Germany

If the limit changes, the runs that are using older tools will be grandfathered in. We will not remove any old runs because of stuff like this.

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