Forum posts

Forum: North & South

Thread: Proposal for Adding Milliseconds

Started by: 8BitsOfJoy8BitsOfJoy

It's been a month and the popular opinion is to add milliseconds to the leaderboard. I should be done frame counting all times of the board, including obsolete runs, in the next few days. At that point I'll add the feature and edit everything accordingly. Thanks to everyone for sharing your thoughts with me.

repuSoiraMrepuSoiraM likes this. 

Forum: North & South

Thread: Proposal for Adding Milliseconds

Started by: 8BitsOfJoy8BitsOfJoy

Due to the short length and precise nature of this run, as well as the increasingly large number of tied times (especially at top ranks), I feel that it might be appropriate to begin timing runs with milliseconds. However, that is my personal opinion, and as a moderator I would like to only make changes that reflect a general consensus of the community.

Therefore, I will be privately contacting every player on the leader board on whether or not milliseconds should be added to all runs. This thread will also remain open for 30 days for anyone that would like to share their opinion publicly. On February 11th, I will post the resulting majority opinion here, which will decide whether or not this change is made.

Currently, there are nine tied times for Lvl 1 NES, which includes a four-way tie for 1st place and a three-way tie for 5th place. There is also a two-way tie for 2nd place for Lvl 2 NES and no tied times for Lvl 3 NES. The Amiga version currently only has one player.

Below is a list of all current tied times after frame counting.

Lvl 1 NES:
00:57.483 DexterClaire
00:57.600 ShesChardcore
00:57.667 k0zzx
00:57.700 Yoho9000
00:58.067 repusoiram
00:58.215 Rayquaza911
00:58.833 authorblues
01:04.481 Roamus
01:04.833 cornshaq

Lvl 2 NES:
00:55.500 ShesChardcore
00:55.900 Yoho9000

If anyone has concerns about not being able to accurately frame count their own runs, I will always be glad to help.

repuSoiraMrepuSoiraM, MortimerNovaMortimerNova and 3 others like this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Hardware and Emulator issues.

Started by: InsomnimaticInsomnimatic

If Retroarch with Genesis Plus GX core / Blastem core and Bizhawk with Genesis Plus GX core are that accurate, then I also feel that a board split is not really necessary, as long as those are the required options. In my personal opinion, if 1-2 frames per transition is the only real difference, then that doesn't seem significant for this kind of run.

DickInDisguiseDickInDisguise and ZeldasKittenZeldasKitten like this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Changing the rules for the IL board timing

Started by: EIGHT

Yeah that's how I understood the rules for ILs. Also, I have no issue with save states for them since it's kind of a special circumstance. Like you said, it's almost like allowing saves states makes the ILs runnable in the first place.

InsomnimaticInsomnimatic likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Changing the rules for the IL board timing

Started by: EIGHT

The reset rule is very common across the site and its for the reasons that EiGhT states here. Although I'm not aware of any global-based timers that control RNG in this game, there is always the possibility that it exists. Heck, maybe all of you are already aware of such RNG, and I'm stuck in the past haha. More importantly though (in my opinion), saves states create a distinct advantage that was never present in the original game.

If there were ever a desire by the community to re-write the rules, I won't stand in the way, but I do think this is actually a pretty important rule.

On a separate note, I may be dumb and missing something as far as the IL discussion goes. If saves states are allowed there, are we discussing a change to the starting point? (please excuse me im a little exhausted today)

InsomnimaticInsomnimatic likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Adding milliseconds in Top runs?

Started by: BronkelBronkel

I like to think that when runs pass a certain threshold of feeling well optimized, and you have top times tied, that's when it seems appropriate to add milliseconds. What that threshold means is subjective of course, but maybe sub 12:30 is a good point to start considering it. However, I don't see any tied times on the board (as of this very moment), so it doesn't seem like there is an immediate need. I would certainly support the addition of milliseconds when those top runs start to become tied up again. That's just my opinion though, but I would be fine with whatever the final decision is.

Also, it shouldn't matter what framerate a video is encoded at. You can still use a program like AVIDEMUX as a standard for frame counting runs across the board and it will tell you the times for starting and ending frames pretty accurately. As in, within a couple of milliseconds at most, whereas a single frame on an actual console is 17ms (16.6881523809523ms specifically). If you wanted to be super accurate, you could even round off to the nearest frame, but that more complicated and shouldn't be necessary unless you find two runs literally tied to the exact same frame.

BronkelBronkel likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: New Mods

Started by: DickInDisguiseDickInDisguise

Thank you @ShadowDraftShadowDraft for taking the time to respond to everyone in depth. It is appreciated. I'm confident that the new moderators will fulfil their mod duties appropriately. However, all of us going forward should please remember to include everyone in an open discussion the next time changes are being considered, or even when someone feels that there is an issue that needs to be resolved. It is the appropriate thing. This is how we maintain the community's integrity, otherwise we are merely undermining ourselves.

PS: Everyone on this leaderboard is great, and we all enjoy the same awesome hobby and game. Let us try to work together so that we can continue enjoying it. 🙂

InsomnimaticInsomnimatic, BronkelBronkel and 3 others like this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: New Mods

Started by: DickInDisguiseDickInDisguise

First of all, I still stand by my point these things should always be a community discussion. Having one member of the community making these decisions with an ex-moderator of the game (who has never run this game) and a site mod (none of which are involved in Lion King) is biased and not indicative of what we as a whole want from our leaderboard. As far as determining the most adequate moderators, the community as a whole would be a much better judge than one sole member.

I will agree that if runs were becoming that backed up, than yes of course we needed more moderators. Even better, some people may have volunteered as verifiers (a role with no mod powers) to verify backlogs of runs. In fact, its generally a good rule of thumb to have at least three moderators.

However, this isn't about personal biases or the need to have people "see" why a certain view is imperative, this should be about the community. Always. About. The. Community. Even this site's moderation guidelines spell it out very clearly in several ways. Community. Not one or two people's opinions greater than everyone else's.

dwarvendynamitedwarvendynamite, SarabiSarabi and 2 others like this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: New Mods

Started by: DickInDisguiseDickInDisguise

(edited: )

First of all, I'd like to point out that I mean no offense to the new moderators by making this post. In fact, Carter44 and Akiteru seem to be reputable runners. Also, I would like to thank you both for accepting the task of moderating our leaderboard. However I'd like to echo the aforementioned concerns made before me, which have been posted by three very active members of the community.

Changes to the leaderboard should always be made with input from the community. The leaderboard represents the community after all. The very first sentence of this site's own "Moderation Rules" page even states "Leaderboards should be viewed as owned by the community and curated by the moderators." This same sentence is also present on the "Game Request" page for people requesting new leaderboards. How does the community own a leaderboard if an outside source comes in and designates new moderators without asking any of the runners on the board? The same "Moderation Rules" page even states "The users moderating a game should represent the consensus of the players of the game." How are the new moderators representing the consensus of the players if multiple active members are claiming that they were never consulted on the matter?

Furthermore, there is the issue of Akiteru not being an active runner in this community. I know that he used to have a run on here, but it was removed at some point and was from several years ago. I only bring this up because, again, this site's own "Moderation Rules" page states "Moderators should typically speedrun the game, or at a minimum be heavily involved with the community." In his defense, he actually is active on the Lion King Discord server, but it's generally as discussion revolving the SNES game.

I understand that it's not easy to be a moderator sometimes, because people do have lives outside of speed running, but this would not have taken much effort to post a new topic in this very forum and just ping the community members. I'm not sure who made this executive decision (btw it obviously wasn't Insomnimatic since he doesn't even have Super Mod privileges to assign new Mods), but it would have been nice, and appropriate, to involve the people that make this game a speed run.

dwarvendynamitedwarvendynamite, SarabiSarabi and 3 others like this. 

Forum: North & South

Thread: Rules Updated

Started by: 8BitsOfJoy8BitsOfJoy

Due to inconsistent timing methods being used on the boards, I have gone ahead and updated the rules to include the exact frames to use for timing runs. This is based on authorblues' run, which also seemed to be the most common timing method used by other runners. All runs are being retimed with the new rules in mind. The complete rules are as follows:

Category Rules:

-Player must be set to "Level[1/2/3]" and opponent must be set to "CPU" and "Level[1/2/3]."

Game Rules:

-Timing starts on the first frame that the cursor is visible on the game map.

-Timing ends on the first frame that the screen is completely black after the final battle that results in victory.

-The game must be reset between runs. A visible reset must be included in submitted runs.

-Game video and audio must be clear in submitted runs.

-For emulator runs, please state the name and version of the emulator used. Smartphone emulators are banned.

repuSoiraMrepuSoiraM and LegsLegs like this. 

Forum: SimCity (NES)

Thread: Curious about timing!

Started by: junkyard_davejunkyard_dave

Option 2 seems better in terms of a visual cue in splitting. Plus, as janglestorm mentioned, it feels like a more complete confirmation of the goal. Option 1 would be fine as well, but I do prefer 2.

junkyard_davejunkyard_dave likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Proposed rules to be implemented

Started by: InsomnimaticInsomnimatic

Just to be clear, I would not consider myself an expert on Retroarch, or any emulator really, and my caution for Retroarch comes from what I've heard from others. It is actually interesting to note that the Genesis Sonic leaderboards (1, 2, 3&K) all allow it to be used as long as the Genesis Plus GX core is used and the Retroarch main menu displaying the current core is shown before the run. The following excerpt can be found in the game rules for each of those games:

-----

"Emulator Rules

The following unofficial emulators are allowed: Kega Fusion, Genesis Plus GX (standalone or through Retroarch.) Links to these emulators can be found in the Resources tab.

The Emulator used must be adequately identifiable at some point during the run (preferably at the start).

Examples

Fusion (only 1 needed)
FPS Visible in the bottom of the window.
Text in the bottom right either showing:
Soft Reset
Hard Reset
x Startup (where x is either "Genesis", "MegaCD" or "Master System")

Retroarch
Showing the Retroarch Menu that displays the Genesis Plus GX core and version in the bottom left.
If not shown at the start of the run, please provide a timestamp in the run description of where this is shown."

-----

So perhaps if the Genesis Sonic community has accepted Retroarch under these conditions, maybe it's not so bad after all? However, if you are able to perform L+R input this way, then it is not fitting our current criteria here anyways. I've tried to test it out myself, but I cannot get the dang thing to work on my end. ~is noob~

Sorry for the rant, but I figured this info might be of interest. 🙂

KingTayyab and InsomnimaticInsomnimatic like this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Proposed rules to be implemented

Started by: InsomnimaticInsomnimatic

I feel like these requirements of input display and showing some sort of visible indication of what emulator is being used (probably through full window capture) are very simple to meet. I would lean more towards these being applied to all future submissions regardless of how fast the run is. However, if everyone rather have them only apply to more competitive submissions, then I'm fine with that as well.

InsomnimaticInsomnimatic likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Proposed rules to be implemented

Started by: InsomnimaticInsomnimatic

Kega Fusion and Genesis Plus GX appear to be two commonly accepted emulators for this platform. Retroarch and OpenEmu (Mac) can both use a Genesis Plus GX core. I've often heard negative things about Retroarch in that it often sacrifices accuracy for stability in it's default options, so it perhaps some investigating should be done on that. OpenEmu is something I know little about outside of it's use of Genesis Plus GX as it's core for Genesis/MD.

InsomnimaticInsomnimatic likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Proposed rules to be implemented

Started by: InsomnimaticInsomnimatic

I'm all for this idea, and is a common emulator rule in many established speedruns for basically the reasons that you mention. We can see if inputs are synchronized with the visible gameplay, and it allows us to pick up on abnormal behavior, such as perfectly timed sequences of inputs that you would see in macro usage. Furthermore, bizhawk should be banned, unless you require the "movie/no movie" toggle to be displayed on such runs. This would allow us to see if a TAS recording is being played back or not. Requiring a full screen display of the emulator may be necessary to let us know which emulator is being used, so that if bizhawk is used, we know to expect the "movie/no movie" display, as well as knowing if a banned emulator is being used or not.

InsomnimaticInsomnimatic likes this. 

Forum: The Site

Thread: Platform Requests / Tagging games to be part of a series / Adjusting game type or game title

Started by: DangerlessDangerless

I'd like to request that the game "Barbie and the Three Musketeers" receive a Series tag for the "Barbie" series. I moderate both the game and the series. Thank you.

Game -> https://www.speedrun.com/barbie_three_musketeers
Series -> https://www.speedrun.com/barbie

ShikenNuggetsShikenNuggets likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Platforms and Rules Addition

Started by: 8BitsOfJoy8BitsOfJoy

With the release of Disney Classic Games: Aladdin and The Lion King, which includes an emulated version of The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive), some changes have been made to the leaderboard.

First of all, PC, PS4, Switch and PC have been added as platforms. Secondly, a line has been added to the rules banning features exclusive to this new release, such as use of saves, level select and rewind. Another line has been added banning L+R, as it is generally a banned emulator function for most speedruns and should have been on the rules already. This new release allows for L+R, so this really needs to be clarified.

This new emulated version of The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive) appears to be accurate to the original game, so in the meantime, we will accept such runs on to this leaderboard. If significant inaccuracies are discovered with this new release, we can address them.

Bluely likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Rules Update Proposal

Started by: 8BitsOfJoy8BitsOfJoy

Since it appears that everyone who has submitted a run in the past several months has either voiced their support of the proposed rules here or via Discord, I have gone ahead and updated the rules for each category. I have also added in the line requiring a visible timer, as suggested by Insomnimatic, since that is a fairly standard rule for speedruns. AlfredoSalza was previously enforcing it as an unspoken rule as well, so it's not necessarily new either.

Thanks again, everyone!

AlfredoSalzaAlfredoSalza likes this. 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Rules Update Proposal

Started by: 8BitsOfJoy8BitsOfJoy

Thank you everyone for the quick responses so far. As for having a visible timer, I personally prefer to see runs that have it, and it does make verifying runs a little easier to be honest. I don't think it is actually necessary, but I will add it to the list unless there are objections to its addition. I am also thinking that we can add a line to "Banned Functions" that simply states that level select codes and any use of cheating devices, such as Game Genies, are not allowed. Really just another common sense rule.

Side note: I do need to try out the Game Gear version at some point. 😃

 

Forum: The Lion King (Genesis/MegaDrive)

Thread: Rules Update Proposal

Started by: 8BitsOfJoy8BitsOfJoy

I forgot one important thing. No existing runs would be affected by the new rule changes.