Henchmen Update: Leaderboard Changes (Proposal)
6 years ago
France

(Shameless copy/paste from the Discord server.)

Hey guys, we've worked on how we should handle the henchmen update for the leaderboards, and here's what we've come up with:

Main leaderboard (unchanged) http://imgur.com/a/Oa4fo

Solo category (detail) http://imgur.com/a/D5RbE

Co-op category (detail) http://imgur.com/a/ErsCz

So basically:

  • Glitchless subcategory is deleted, and replaces the currently obsolete "Major Skip" variable. This means kicking/rejoining becomes legit (but more on that topic later), and you no longer have to submit duplicate runs (unless it's a DW+ run, submit it in any diff as well)
  • Solo (any + DW+) is the category the most affected by the henchmen boosts. Because of this, there is now any% and botless subcategories, of course the run that gets displayed on the main page is the fastest among both categories. Botless doesn't include previous runs done with bots, for the sole reason that otherwise it would sort of become a duplicate if Overkill changed the interaction speed boost. This subcategory is focused on challenge rather than perfect time, so while it will often be beaten by bot runs, it is still interesting.
  • Co-op is slightly less affected, but it widens the gap between 2, 3 and 4-player runs as they play differently with or without bot boosts. Those 3 subcategories now stand on their own, and bots are always allowed (well, except for 4-player runs as it would be hard to play with bots). The number of players becomes a STRICT rule. You must always have 2/3/4 players at any time during a game, so no kicking/disconnecting/rejoining. Disconnecting/rejoining is allowed between days. Kicking is allowed if one player stands on the escape. Time displayed on the main page will still be the fastest among all 4 subcategories, but at least there is a way to create micro-leaderboards inside the co-op category. So splitting the leaderboard to be fair without splitting it too much, so that newcomers can still find records easily.
  • The fourth "Shuffle" subcategory is a new one that benefit from bot boosts. You can do whatever you want, like start a game with 4 players, have 2 people leave the game so that the remaining 2 benefit from bot boosts, then have a third person join until the end. Also, if doing a "shuffle" run, still limit it to 4 different players. For now. It can change if someone provides an amazing 6-player run or something like that.

Pros for that system is that we will depend less on future updates, it will be easier for us mods to transfer already existing runs to the new subcategories, and those subcategories apply both to IL and full game runs while being easy to implement using the current ones. Also it avoids category clutter issues like you can see on this (rejected) draft. http://imgur.com/a/wD3lN

Feel free to ask if you have any question/doubt about the new system, and please tell us if you are okay with it. If replies are overwhelmingly positive we will implement it, otherwise we'll discuss with you guys to find another workaround.

(Also henchmen beta runs will be allowed retroactively.)

Edited by the author 6 years ago
France

FAQ:

Q: What about having bots but without bot boosts? A: No distinction ATM between bots with or without boosts. It's a take-it or leave. Considering Overkill might add a feature like a no boosts for fewer spawns trade-off, I think this is the best way to do. We have to consider that they can grab bags too now. And bot or botless, with or without boosts, now it makes a difference (in solo).

Q: "Kicking is allowed if one player stands on the escape." About that, does it means that you can only kick/disconnect on the last day of the heist or at the end of any day? A: At the end of any day. That means that after your "kicking spree", the heist has to stop (with a successful outcome), that is done to avoid objectives being done with the bots that replace kicked players. If you kick regardless, the run then belongs to the "shuffle" subcategory.

Q: So all current runs would go to botless category? A: If you didn't use bots, yes.

Edited by the author 6 years ago
notPlancha likes this
France

Hi Salem, I think that we should keep the Glitchless category because some great runs are'nt rewarded enought instead of some glitchy one that are already way more visible (main leaderboard). Like in GGC, I have a glitchless run with perfect RNG but if nobody can see it because it is glitchless so slower than the other one it is not worth it for the speedrunner in my opinion. Your choice guys. New co-op category are great. And I don't enought about what's new with the bot to talk about it. Keep it up, great job everyone.

France

It's not possible to keep Glitchless at the same time as other subcategories without doubling their amount. It will still exist as a variable that you can use to filter leaderboards.

I have to admit I forgot about consoles when I discussed with other moderators, from now on you'd better play without bots because your runs will be included in categories where PC players have a clear advantage over you (latest PC update made so bots can give you a 75% interaction speed boost, hence the urge of redesigning leaderboards). Hopefully Overkill will update console version soon enough, the upcoming Switch release should be a decent reason for it.

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